Choices, choices

Been looking at a Duratec V6, i know ill have to make a adaptor plate to mate it to a MT75 or T5 box, which dosnt particulary phase me.
However has anyone actually fitted this engine?. it would be good to get someone elses thoughts on this.

One of the reasons ive been looking at this engine is a ex colleague of mine knows an awful lot about this engine, except it was only in his probe, not a kit car.
Also it does sound loverly

Im currently trying to find the dimensions of the engine to make sure it would fit my book chassis, although iirc the cologne v6 will fit a book chassis, and this is a smaller engine?

if not, im not bothered about spending anoher £50 on steel to make another +4 chassis.

I think this falls into the ecotec V6 catogery.People are a bit phased by it.But with the likes of megajolt/megasquirt systems for the running of it about it should be more popular IMO.The vauxhall unit even comes with a rearwheel drive box in a whole Omega.Size wise it shouldn't be a problem.There RV8's in Locosts and other lsis

[Edited on 28/8/05 by TPG]

Probe... That's the mazda engine then isn't it? Not the ford duratec used in the mondeo nowadays. Very nice engine. If you can fit a V8 you wont have any trouble with a 6. Good article in this months PPC about making adaptor plates.

Vauxhall V6 is nice too but unfortunately made of iron so a bit lardy.

Liam

The 24v probe engine will be a bit wider than the colgne but should go in. You may need to loose both conventional R tubes in the engine bay and go with two Y-braces instead.

Liam

quote:

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Originally posted by Liam
Probe... That's the mazda engine then isn't it? Not the ford duratec used in the mondeo nowadays. Very nice engine. If you can fit a V8 you wont have any trouble with a 6. Good article in this months PPC about making adaptor plates.

Vauxhall V6 is nice too but unfortunately made of iron so a bit lardy.

Liam

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Nah - going way back in time here - to a previous ford mazda arrangement. The old ford probe used a mazda V6. I believe it was actually called a k-series (not to be mistaken with the rovers of course) and came in 1.8, 2.0 (i think, maybe 2.3) and 2.5. Most of them are in mazda mx6's 323's etc. It's not a duratec and aint the same as the all ford V6 used in the mondeo and onwards.

Liam

Apologies liam...

Im barking up the wrong tree again

So gav - which engine are you talking about?? The mazda Probe V6 or a ford duratec? Maybe the ford duratec V6 was a fruit of the development of the mazda engine - not really sure...

liam

well i was actually looking at the one on ebay that tim 45 refered to in a different post says its from a mondeo.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ford-2-5-litre-Duratec-24v-V6-Mondeo-Cougar_W0QQitemZ4571552893QQcategoryZ21654QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

However my mate who had the probe said it'll be the same engine as the probe (164bhp-ish)

I didnt think actually developed their own duratec V6?

humm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Duratec

if ford did produce their own V6 then hopefully it might be mateable to a T5/MT75?

its funny i think ive just got the horn for a v6

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Alfa-156-2-5-24v-V6-engine_W0QQitemZ7995975664QQcategoryZ10370QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

and these things sound amazing on full chat

Your friend's probe engine is this one...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazda_K_engine

Not a ford duratec, but I really dont know how different they are. At the end of the day they're both 24v 2.5l ally v6s (like those of many manafacturers), however they're probably very unlikely to share tuning parts, common faults, etc etc, so your friend's Probe knowledge might not be much use if you get the ebay duratec.

With regards a mondeo duratec fitting a ford RWD gearbox, as far as i'm aware the answer to that has yet to be added to the collective knowledge of this site! Go on - be a pioneer, get it and compare bolt patterns! One thing i can say is it will definately not have the same bolt pattern as the 4cyl gearboxes. If it shares the cologne V6 bolt pattern you're laughing but i have a feeling we would have heard by now if it does.

Oh and I can totally understand having the horn for V6s!! Honda is my choice.

Liam

Ooooohhh!!

According to that mazda engine article, get yourself a Japan import of the 2.5 V6 and it has 200 ponies! Nice.

Liam

Yeah, this is what phil(Mr Probe) used to say that the ford version was detuned as the original design was for 200bhp.

hehe imr really tempted
the main problem is ill have to get friendly with a local engineer shop to make the adaptor plate!.
Also ill have to mod the sump for RWD orientation as the oil pick up would be at the front.

Edit: Also mr probe reckons that the engine is good for 8000rpm with a suitably large FPR and the air con/PAS removed.

[Edited on 29/8/05 by Gav]

I'd like to know what it weighs, complete. I know you're going for front engine, rear drive, but it would sure be helpful to know what a complete FWD version with tranny and accessaries weighs.

I had an import MX6 and the extra extra 35 bhp was great, I ran it without any problems until the car had covered 200k miles, then traded it for a v6 C Class Merc (now that would be a nice donor). The probe exhaust sounded better than the Mazda. I also think that the Suzuki Vitara 2.5 uses the Mazda engine but not sure which BHP is has 165 UK spec or 198 Jap spec.

I considered the V6 duratec a while ago. I may be wrong but i believe that Morgan use this engine and a fairly recent jag gearbox. We all know who owns Jaguar.
Noble use this engine too but with a couple of turbos and those things go like greased sh*t off a hot shovel!!!!!!!!!!

I asked the guy selling the duratec on ebay for the engine number so i could check which version it is.
He said it dosnt have a number on it and that perhaps because it was never fitted to a car thats why it has no number

i smell something fishy!

remember the st220 and jag s-type 3ltr v6's are essentially the same engine with i believe different heads and put out over 200bhp in standard trim. i know of a mountune 3ltr v6 making around hte 330bhp mark if you've got the cash to spare

Ned.

Im not going to continue with this duratec on ebay if the guy canrt find the engine number. i need to know its a kosher engine before ill part with the cash.

Hmmm looks like there are plenty of numbers on the engine in the photos...

Wouldn't an engine be numbered during production and not just only if it gets put in a car? Dunno? If it really has no number cos it's brand new (and clearly is from the photos) it could well be perfectly legit - but still might have issues when it comes to sva and registration. You'd have to check that out cos i dont know. Maybe if its new you can have a number of your choice stamped on it??

Liam

[Edited on 31/8/05 by Liam]

All engines should have a unique number stamped on them at manufacture.
and yeah i asked him if he cold get me the numbers on the side of the block but hasnt got back to me.
Like i said im not willing to risk the cash if im not 100% sure its ligit.
Also he said he got it from ebay anyway.

Hmmm. Maybe he got it for a kit car, found he couldn't register it, and is flogging it? Could well be wrong. Maybe his engine is better for somebody with a car already registered. Plenty of duratecs about...

Liam

i originally asked what he was gonna use it for just out of interest but got no reply to that one either.

there are so many cheap old v6 mondeo's about there will be another. i wouldn't waste your time if the guy isn't being very helpful. you can buy an entire car for a couple of hundred quid, possibly less...

true, but ive just seen that fireblade engine on ebay

As a matter of interest I am using a Duratec V6 in my Aeon middy - very compact it is too. The main challenge is finding an ECU and loom at a reasonable price.

If you want, I can email you a spec sheet which might be useful

oops - meant to post a pic
Rescued attachment aeon rear.jpg

Very nice

Decided to go with a fireblade engine for this build though.

Just out of interest did which ECU did you use, the standard one? as i assume this would take care of the variable valve timing.

A 4 valve V6 might actually be wider than a 2 valve V8. So just because a V8 will fit doesn't mean that a V6 will !

Also due to the angle of the V a V8 exhaust is possibly going down and out of the engine bay more steeply than a V6 exhaust and so is more likely to miss the engine bay sides.

A measurement across the entire engine, including all the ancilliaries and the exhaust headers is what you need. The bare engine can be mis leading!

quote:

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Originally posted by Gav
Just out of interest did which ECU did you use, the standard one? as i assume this would take care of the variable valve timing.

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when i was looking at it i was looking at mega squirt, the only problem was getting the variable value timing to kick in.

might be worth you checking http://www.probetalk.com for ecu options

To be honest I didn't know that it had VVT - no mention of it in the spec. Are we talking about the same engine? The Ford 2.5L V6 24 valve Duratec VE?
You might be referring to the Jaguar AJ-V6 engine and Mazda's AJ version which both have VVT.


[Edited on 17-9-05 by RazMan]

eer sorry meant the variable intake length thingy VRIS think it was called.
Variable Resonance Induction System.

Ah, I'm with you now

Sure enough, you will have a job trying to integrate Ford's VRIS into any engine management system. I have been told that the easiest way is to hold the secondary inlet butterflies open permanently with a bracket of some sort and treat it as a conventional engine from there - in theory this would mean a small loss of low-down torque (which shouldn't hurt too much in a light kit car) but I have yet to jump this canyon to see if this is true I have lightened the flywheel to help make the engine more revvy so I doubt that I will find this much of a problem.


[Edited on 18-9-05 by RazMan]

Ah ok, well let me know how you get on with it.

interestingly enough you can get the source for the megasquirt system
http://sourceforge.net/search/?type_of_search=soft&words=megasquirt&imageField.x=0&imageField.y=0

I had visions of adding an output when the revs hit the required RPM.

infact i want to play about with he megasquirt stuff so once my car is completed with fireblade engine running carbs im thinking of making my own throttle bodies and setting up the megasqurit stuff for fun and as a good learning excercise.

any how let me know how you get on

If you make sure you use a V6 from a Mk2 mondeo, there is a box just under the black plastic cover on the front that deals with opening the secondaries. You could easily knobble this box I think. Basically program a digital output on the ECU to open the secondaries at around 2500-3000 rpm or at any revs under wide open throttle then you are away...

Forogt to add: Visit the forums at www.fordmondeo.org for infor/advice about any mondeo engine. These chaps were a goldmine when I had engine hassles with my V6 (In the mondeo)

quote:

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Originally posted by aweekes1
Forogt to add: Visit the forums at www.fordmondeo.org for infor/advice about any mondeo engine. These chaps were a goldmine when I had engine hassles with my V6 (In the mondeo)

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Been lookin over the years at all these muscle engines for Lotus seven types. Am I missing something or pray tell me .....How on earth can you put all that power down on to the road without spending a fortune reworking frame suspension etc. Don`t see how you can use it other than on a short flat dry stretch of road for a short distance.....Especially witha live axle
Alex

FOUR WHEEL DRIIIIIVE!!!!

Woo hoo!!