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Author: Subject: Another piece of bureaucracy for us kit builders in France?
AdrianH

posted on 25/1/17 at 06:53 PM Reply With Quote
Another piece of bureaucracy for us kit builders in France?

Perhaps you may know about this anyway?

Quote from the website

RAC linky

Windscreen stickers which show a vehicle’s emissions levels have become a legal requirement in several key French cities including Paris.

British drivers heading to the France capital are advised by the RAC that driving without a France 'clean air' sticker – which costs as little as £3.20 – makes them culpable for an on-the-spot fine of up to £117.

So wonder what I could do in my old H reg age related Kit car, looks like I would be banded from several French cities.

Also what if you have no windscreen?



Adrian


[Edited on 25-1-17 by AdrianH]

[Edited on 27-1-17 by AdrianH]





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morcus

posted on 25/1/17 at 07:19 PM Reply With Quote
From that article I would say Kit cars are probably now effectively banned in those cities between 0800 and 2000. I could be wrong but the bottom bit saying about cars from before 1997, bikes from 2000 and commercials from 2001 seems to suggest they are the vehicles not eligible to get a sticker.

here

[Edited on 25/1/17 by morcus]





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r1_pete

posted on 25/1/17 at 07:47 PM Reply With Quote
Well my solution is simple, I wont go to France...
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AdrianH

posted on 25/1/17 at 08:01 PM Reply With Quote
I can not determine from the RAC website or the French Crit’Air website if you need to show a sticker just in the cities or you must have one anyway when in France.

I guess as it seems to effect all French motorists, that they must be displayed anywhere and they determine if you are allowed in a city or not during high pollution days.

So a bit like you must have breathalysers when anywhere in France.
makes it a bit awkward if you intend to pop across on the ferry and then head up to Belgium/Netherlands etc.

Although there is a simulation that gets me a "1" sticker which I assume is the worst type!

Adrian





Why do I have to make the tools to finish the job? More time then money.
Build diary at http://www.tamarisktechnicals.com/pages/roadster.html

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voucht

posted on 25/1/17 at 08:23 PM Reply With Quote
Hi,

Being French, I think I can help you.

First, it is not another unjustified bureaucracy nonsense, but a way to try to limit the pollution in the big cities certain days (when there are pollution level peaks) by banning the most polluting vehicles these specific days. It is not a permanent banning (for now !)

The purpose of this sticker is for the authorities to be able to identify the category of your vehicle in case of circulation restriction. There are 6 categories, from the cleaner to the most polluting. According to the pollution levels, some categories can be banned. For example today, only the 4 fist categories were allowed to drive in Paris. It is not every day, only they days with a pollution peak (which, OK, is oftener and oftener).

The only places where this has been enforced for now are Paris and Grenoble. Paris is big, with a lot of vehicles, and Grenoble is much smaller, but at the bottom of a valley where the pollution stays, so the levels are high. But there will be much more cities concerned by that in the near future, all the cities with a "Pollution Protection Plan" : Avignon, Béthune, Bordeaux, Clermont-Ferrand, Douai-Lens, Grenoble, Lille, Lyon, Marseille-Aix-en-Provence, Metz, Montpellier, Nancy, Nantes, Nice, Orléans, Pointe-à-Pitre-Les-Abymes, Rennes, Rouen, Saint-Etienne, Strasbourg, Toulon, Toulouse, Tours, Valenciennes.)

If your kit car is age related, so is the sticker. The last category, the "Grey" sticker, is for vehicles between 1997 and 2000. So what about vehicles before 1997 ? Well, no stickers for them : they are already banned (they've been since July 2016), from 8 to 20 on week days (from Monday to Friday), what ever the pollution levels are. So, you can only drive a car older than 20 years at night, and during the week-end. Again, this is only for Paris (I don't know about Grenoble and old cars), everywhere else, it is OK to drive an old car, for now.

When it comes to your kit car, I don't think you enjoy driving it in the trafic jams anyway, so Paris is certainly not the best place to take it There are so much more nice places to drive your car in the country side where it will be long before there are any circulation restrictions because of the pollution! Keep off the big cities, and you'll be fine.

!and if you don't have a windscreen, no problem, there are other means of displaying it, as these circulation restrictions also concern motorbikes. So you'll be able to stick it where you can, as long as it is : "front face of the sticker visible, at the front of the vehicle, in a visible location".

I'm not defending this law, I just try to explain. Pollution is a big issue, this is for sure not THE solution, it is one thing they can do, but it is not ideal of course. (there is not only ONE solution anyway in my humble opinion).

Hope I could help to clarify the situation.





Sylvain
http://vouchtroadster.blogspot.se/

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voucht

posted on 25/1/17 at 08:26 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by AdrianH
I can not determine from the RAC website or the French Crit’Air website if you need to show a sticker just in the cities or you must have one anyway when in France


No, it is only for going in the cities that are concerned by circulation restriction due to pollution. I live in a small village in the south of France, and I don't need sticker for my Kangoo !





Sylvain
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gremlin1234

posted on 25/1/17 at 08:33 PM Reply With Quote
I dont think its very different from the London 'low emissions zone' where it is enforced by number plate recognition. foreign vehicles have to register, whereas uk vehicles the info is already known.
https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/low-emission-zone

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AdrianH

posted on 25/1/17 at 09:15 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by voucht
quote:
Originally posted by AdrianH
I can not determine from the RAC website or the French Crit’Air website if you need to show a sticker just in the cities or you must have one anyway when in France


No, it is only for going in the cities that are concerned by circulation restriction due to pollution. I live in a small village in the south of France, and I don't need sticker for my Kangoo !


OK thanks for that it was the statement on the RAC site of "The scheme requires vehicles to have an emissions sticker clearly visible on the windscreen. The penalty for not displaying one is an on-the-spot fine of between €68 and €135 (about £58 to £117).

So if basically passing through the top of France I should be OK?

Adrian





Why do I have to make the tools to finish the job? More time then money.
Build diary at http://www.tamarisktechnicals.com/pages/roadster.html

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voucht

posted on 25/1/17 at 09:30 PM Reply With Quote
quote:


So if basically passing through the top of France I should be OK?

Adrian


Yes, you should be fine, if you don't cross one of the cities I've cited. If you do (Béthune, Lille, Valenciennes, are in the north of France), check if they have enforced the circulation restrictions a couple of weeks before you go.





Sylvain
http://vouchtroadster.blogspot.se/

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SteveWalker

posted on 25/1/17 at 10:40 PM Reply With Quote
Seems a bit over the top. How much difference would it make if visitors there for a short period were allowed full access no matter the age of their vehicle?
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robinj66

posted on 25/1/17 at 11:26 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SteveWalker
Seems a bit over the top. How much difference would it make if visitors there for a short period were allowed full access no matter the age of their vehicle?



And the answer to that is a "Gallic shrug"

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Toprivetguns

posted on 25/1/17 at 11:37 PM Reply With Quote
Please not Le Man !!!!!





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redturner
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Building: Run 2 ltr Black Top in single seater race car.

posted on 26/1/17 at 09:59 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SteveWalker
Seems a bit over the top. How much difference would it make if visitors there for a short period were allowed full access no matter the age of their vehicle?

I would like to do the sprint at Crystal Palace, but if I risk it with my ancient camper I will get a very large bill for fouling the atmosphere for a 'short period '.....

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AdrianH

posted on 26/1/17 at 10:10 PM Reply With Quote
Can I take this topic in a different direction.

If I was to fit a later zetec engine with ECU and CAT could I change the emmisions standard on the V5 or am I stuck with what I have now?

What do Q plate kits that are registered now having to have, surely not visual only, I guess must be based on modern specs?

Adrian





Why do I have to make the tools to finish the job? More time then money.
Build diary at http://www.tamarisktechnicals.com/pages/roadster.html

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gremlin1234

posted on 27/1/17 at 05:51 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Toprivetguns
Please not Le Man !!!!!
the thisismoney page says that 22 other cities are planning.
these are
Avignon
Faucigny, Glières, Bonneville
Arras
Lille
Annemasse
Le Havre
Bordeaux
Montpellier
Cannes
Reims
Clermont-Ferrand
Rouen
Champlan Saint-Etienne
Côte Basque-Adour
Strasbourg
Dunkerque
Saint Maur-des-Fossés
Dijon
Toulouse
Epernay
Vallée de la Marne

note Le Havre, Rouen, & Dunkerque may all be on the way to LeMans


[Edited on 27/1/17 by gremlin1234]

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