Printable Version | Subscribe | Add to Favourites
New Topic New Poll New Reply
Author: Subject: emissions again
hobzy

posted on 11/6/11 at 11:20 AM Reply With Quote
emissions again

Just been up to the garage for a pre-mot checkover. First time at this garage run by a recently made friend. Problem is the CO was 4.9% . I know a cat will bring it down, but any ideas what else to try to get it down to 0.5?

2001 r1 with a power commander






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
Gary 7

posted on 11/6/11 at 03:23 PM Reply With Quote
If your car is a q plate ,have a look at your registration document first section 3. Mine says a co limit of 3.5., without the proof tester wanted a co 0.5 based on engine age .
View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
adithorp

posted on 11/6/11 at 06:30 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by hobzy
Just been up to the garage for a pre-mot checkover. First time at this garage run by a recently made friend. Problem is the CO was 4.9% . I know a cat will bring it down, but any ideas what else to try to get it down to 0.5?

2001 r1 with a power commander


4.9% is way more than a cat will cope with. Thats very rich and might well be enough to stop the cat working at all. You need to put some negative values into the power commander map in the test areas (idle and 2500-3000rpm assuming it's the BETs test limits you need to meet). You need to get the pre-cat' CO down below 1.5% I'd say.





"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire

http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/

View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 11/6/11 at 06:53 PM Reply With Quote
Ta, not had to touch the power commander yet so looks like i'll have to do some research!

Not on a q plate,so going on the emissions on the special notes on the front of my v5.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
SteveWalker

posted on 11/6/11 at 06:57 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gary 7
If your car is a q plate ,have a look at your registration document first section 3. Mine says a co limit of 3.5., without the proof tester wanted a co 0.5 based on engine age .


Mine's Q plated, but despite going through SVA, the emissions box on the V5 is blank - it therefore gets tested on visible smoke only. It was tested on engine age at first, but then the tester cottoned on to the rules.

View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
sglover

posted on 16/6/11 at 09:45 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by hobzy
Just been up to the garage for a pre-mot checkover. First time at this garage run by a recently made friend. Problem is the CO was 4.9% . I know a cat will bring it down, but any ideas what else to try to get it down to 0.5?

2001 r1 with a power commander

View User's Profile E-Mail User View All Posts By User U2U Member
sglover

posted on 16/6/11 at 09:53 PM Reply With Quote
emissions

I have just started work on my Busa engine for emissions and found that the power commander has made cyclinders 2 and 4 rich and 1 and 3 lean, the differenc between them is about 9 % CO or 3.5 AFR. I welded emissions take off point son to the down pipes and got an analyser to check each at idle and found this problem. The issue is with the power commander as the injectroes ahve been flow matched and the air flows balanced and checked with a flow balancer. when trying to lean out the map th etow lean cyclinders begine to misfire and i get a bonfire in the catalyst. If you have teh same issue you will need to match all 4 cylinders to egt equal AFR by the advanced map function s and then lean out to about 1.5 % CO or 13.5 AFR. Then add secondardy air form the PAIR system and you will have the oxygen to oxidise the CO and HC emisisons. operating these engines leaner than 1.5 % CO is not good without being able to change the ignition and retarding the timing. So i would check the individual cylinder emissions.

Steve




]Originally posted by hobzy
Just been up to the garage for a pre-mot checkover. First time at this garage run by a recently made friend. Problem is the CO was 4.9% . I know a cat will bring it down, but any ideas what else to try to get it down to 0.5?

2001 r1 with a power commander

View User's Profile E-Mail User View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 16/6/11 at 10:04 PM Reply With Quote
Jesus that sounds complicated!

Why is nothing simple?






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
sglover

posted on 17/6/11 at 07:07 AM Reply With Quote
yes, i am checking it today and will let you know how i get on. i have borrowed an Horiba Mexa analyser for the down pipe emissions (with 4 valves to select each cylinder) and a Horiba AFR broadband scanner for the 4 into 1 part. I suspect the power commander but will check the Suzuki std set up and the reconnect the power commander. ] if its not the power commander then its the injectors which i had checked last week by an injector specalist on the UK mainland.

Originally posted by hobzy
Jesus that sounds complicated!

Why is nothing simple?

View User's Profile E-Mail User View All Posts By User U2U Member
ruskino80

posted on 20/6/11 at 01:03 PM Reply With Quote
2004 r1 with a power commander
View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 20/6/11 at 08:48 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ruskino80
2004 r1 with a power commander


Cheers Rich - typo.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 20/6/11 at 08:50 PM Reply With Quote
Got a CAT sorted and a couple of Maps. I'll let you know how I get on on Saturday.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 2/7/11 at 04:44 PM Reply With Quote
No luck.

Even leaned right out with the power commander (reluctant to lean it out any more than -31!) and the CAT in place and hot, couldn't get it down below 1% CO consistently.

I don't have the skill or knowledge to do any of the stuff sglover has mentioned so I'm stuck. Passed everything else on the MOT except emissions. Luckily hes not charging me for the trial runs.

Any ideas what to do next anyone? John is keen to help but he's a car man not a bike guy.

5PW R1






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
lewis

posted on 2/7/11 at 05:35 PM Reply With Quote
stick the probe up another car
View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 2/7/11 at 06:30 PM Reply With Quote
That's how it "possibly might have " got through for the last 4 years . Unfortunately that's not an option any more.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 2/7/11 at 08:27 PM Reply With Quote
How much difference would a tiny leak in the 4 to 1 manifold joint cause? Just found one but its right in the middle of where the 4 pipes meet - not sure how to get some putty down there...

I'll do an oil change too and after a peruse of a few threads on here, I'll take the filter off and wrap the CAT to keep it hot.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
adithorp

posted on 2/7/11 at 09:04 PM Reply With Quote
As it's not a closed loop system (ECU reading fueling via lambda sensor to adjust fueling) an air leak won't alter the CO reading. though it will effect the lambda reading on the gas meter.

How much difference are you seeing between the reading with a cold cat and when you've warmed it up? I'd suspect not a lot. It takes a lot of constant high revs to get enough heat into the cat' to "light it up" and get the reaction. You're looking for 400'c ish and an external cat with no heat shield will loose temp almost as quick as you can put it in. Wrap it and see how that helps.





"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire

http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/

View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 2/7/11 at 09:51 PM Reply With Quote
Ta. Will give it a try.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
matt_gsxr

posted on 2/7/11 at 09:59 PM Reply With Quote
Have you considered increasing the idle speed slightly. Most maps have extra fueling at the bottom of the table to discourage stalling. If you are a bit slow then you might have run into the extra fueling and additional advance that you get down there.

Just a thought.

Matt

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member   matt_gsxr 's Aim
hobzy

posted on 2/7/11 at 10:48 PM Reply With Quote
Yes tried that. Even tried leaning out the bottom of the map - started running on 2 cylinders so quickly changed the map!

How do you change the fuel pressure?






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
G.Man

posted on 5/7/11 at 08:04 AM Reply With Quote
Does the R1 engine have reed plates on the cam cover?

If so, have you blocked them off?

If you have, unblock them as they draw air into the exhaust to burn off unburnt fuel, it made a massive difference on my zx12 emissions

A power commander cannot remap individual cylinders afaik so if you are having fueling isues on 2 cylinders it is time to check something else.





Opinions are like backsides..
Everyone has one, nobody wants to hear it and only other peoples stink!

View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member This User Has MSN Messenger
hobzy

posted on 5/7/11 at 11:36 PM Reply With Quote
Clearly out of my depth now! I need to find a bike engine guy down here
Ta for the advice.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
iiyama

posted on 6/7/11 at 06:23 AM Reply With Quote
Mate, get it on a rolling road and a reasonable map rather then a 'guess it' map.

RE:Worx or JKM in Pompey both have RR's. I know them well at the former and they mapped my car, the latter have a good rep too.

Ian





If its broke, fix it. If it aint broke, take it apart and find out how it works!

View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
hobzy

posted on 6/7/11 at 06:39 AM Reply With Quote
It was mapped at holeshot for previous owner without the cat, how much is that going to cost me?!. This is getting daft. The damn cats coming straight off once its passed. Ran fine grrr.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member

New Topic New Poll New Reply


go to top






Website design and SEO by Studio Montage

All content 2001-16 LocostBuilders. Reproduction prohibited
Opinions expressed in public posts are those of the author and do not necessarily represent
the views of other users or any member of the LocostBuilders team.
Running XMB 1.8 Partagium [ 2002 XMB Group] on Apache under CentOS Linux
Founded, built and operated by ChrisW.