depends on diff,wheel size,tyre,compound, weight of car,weight of driver, tarmac quality etc etc. there are many variables but I can safely say not 3 seconds.probably 4.5 - 5 secs in the real world!
Hi all.been in a couple of mach#1s and was wondering what the 0-60 time is with the zx10 engine in?an owner I know says 3 seconds which I'm unsure of as it didn't feel that quick.
4.5secs or 5.0 secs
Really?so nowhere near 3 seconds then?
Around 4 seconds if it has slicks and LSD fitted, 3 sounds like beer talk.
3 seconds? was it turbo'd
depends on diff,wheel size,tyre,compound, weight of car,weight of driver, tarmac quality etc etc. there are many variables but I can safely say not 3
seconds.probably 4.5 - 5 secs in the real world!
Thanks for the quick replies and the honesty.when I went in the zx10 I wasn't impressed at all with the acceleration.it handled well and braking was good but I just couldn't believe the owners claims of being a 3 second car.he says that he "will waste Ferraris and lambos" which I just couldn't believe.
When I got mine it had been data logged @ 3.6 secs 0.60mph I have tried and cant get it down below 4 secs as I cant change gear fast enough I keep
hitting the rev limiter set @ 7800rpm lol, and mine has over 320 bhp and fairly low gearing.
but it still feels like its ripping your face off
Alfie
320bhp!!!!!! Wow is it turbocharged?
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mackey
320bhp!!!!!! Wow is it turbocharged?
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mackey
320bhp!!!!!! Wow is it turbocharged?
I see.will weigh a bit more than a bike engined mach#1 though right?
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mackey
Thanks for the quick replies and the honesty. he says that he "will waste Ferraris and lambos" which I just couldn't believe.
I can get down to 3.3-3.5 to 60 and under 7 secs to 100. But it isn't a BEC.
The difference in a BEC with and without a passenger is unreal.
with my old car (GSXR1000 K4 so basically the same) I got fed up saying to mates "trust me, its a lot faster with just me!"
It would whack any supercar to 60.
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mackey
I see.will weigh a bit more than a bike engined mach#1 though right?
quote:
Originally posted by Jon Ison
That part is actually factualy correct, a BEC will "waste" the majority of Ferraris for example are well over 4 seconds to 60.
I can confirm that M3 powered 7's are very quick :-)
Sam, the question was 0-60 not top speed, I'm not pissing up anyone's back either, in the pub or thinking of selling but thanks all the
same.
IMHO for what it's worth most BECs on decent rubber should be able to attain nearer to 4 than 5 seconds to reach 60 especially if measured in the
most favrable conditions possible as I'm sure Ferrari for example do, according to my digidash I can dip under 4 seconds consitantly on road
legal but nicely warmed up 888's, never tried it on slicks value my drivetrain to much with all that BEC grunt it would ripp the back axle out
Torque not horsepower is the advantage in 0-60 0-100 games
and highlights the BEC CEC differences
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
Torque not horsepower is the advantage in 0-60 0-100 games
and highlights the BEC CEC differences
but gives some interesting back to back results: 
If you want to do 0-60, 0-100, get a drag car!!!
It's all about the corners
Yeh and if you really want to do corners get a go Kart
Its all about power.
Alfie
[Edited on 24/4/14 by alfiebeard]
Thanks for all the replys.went out again in the zx10.still the acceleration felt tame.my friend has a 400 bhp impreza and even when the massive weight
difference is seems much quicker.i must say through the twistys the zx10 was quick I'm still unsure which way to go.a mach#1 or something like
impreza/Evo/gtr.
[Edited on 27/4/14 by Mr Mackey]
The Scooby will be quicker off the line because it has 4WD and much better traction.
It will be much quicker in the upper speed ranges, because it has more outright power (as opposed to power:weight ratio), hence there will be
more power left over for acceleration once you've subtracted the rolling resistance and aerodynamic drag. Aerodynamic drag goes up exponentially
in proportion to speed, so this becomes very noticeable as speeds rise.
There may be a narrow band between the BEC establishing decent traction and the aero drag starting to absorb a high proportion of its available
horsepower where the BEC might have an advantage.
But if kick-in-the-pants acceleration at decent (motorway/A-road) speeds is your thing, then the BEC's not going to do it for you: they're
more about precise and inertia-free handling and carrying the momentum than monster top-end performance.
Sevens in general, and BEC's in particular, are very much a one-trick pony. Don't get me wrong; it's a good trick, but if
it's not what you're after, then they're the wrong car for you.
Sounds like you want a nicely built CEC.
I think I need to go in a cec as it's been a while since I've had the pleasure.the zx10 just didn't cut the mustard I'm afraid.if
I'm spending my hard earned I need to be 100% happy and if I had the zx10 bec in be hiding from my mate in the Subaru
ive had powerful imprezas and evos and non of them got off the line like my radical can! although I do run softer tyres,the performance is worlds apart.the radical is in a different league.
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mackey
I think I need to go in a cec...
there was a 'brick shaped' westy at Aintree crossing the finishing line at over 140mph yesterday! not too shabby
quote:
Originally posted by daniel mason
there was a 'brick shaped' westy at Aintree crossing the finishing line at over 140mph yesterday! not too shabby
Just to add: I remembered that I actually did an empirical analysis of the comparative power requirements for a BEC vs. CEC Westfield SEi some time
ago.
I've just dug out the spreadsheet and plugged in the relevant numbers. For comparison, it says that for a Westfield to achieve a peak speed
similar to the (streamlined) circa 90bhp Eleven would take approximately 262bhp (assuming 15% transmission loss). So whatever was running at Aintree
must have had comfortably more than that, to be capable of accelerating to 140mph in the relatively short distance.*
In other words, a properly streamlined bodyshell (well, properly by the standards of 1957!) could give an advantage equivalent to about 170bhp.
In BEC terms, that's a second engine's worth...
* edited to add:
Except that according to the results HERE, it was
134mph terminal speed, not 140mph (I assume it's John Hoyle's results you're talking about?). Due to the exponential nature of aero
drag, it makes a big difference. 134mph would only absorb about 205bhp, again assuming 15% transmission loss. The calculated power requirements vs.
the Eleven still hold, however.
[Edited on 27/4/14 by Sam_68]
depends what bec you refer too?
quote:
Originally posted by daniel mason
depends what bec you refer too?
Pervious owner of mine showed me a slip from some speed trial he had been to.
3.1 to 60, 6.6 to 100...
So I can't see a zx10 engined car doing it in 3.... Unless he has a silly diff ratio and can change gear like the wind!!
It does have a bike gearbox in I think.
So does mine, as will all other BEC's.
More likely to be 4-5 sec.
wikipedia?
I'm glad all the owners on here have been honest.i knew it wasn't as quick as my mate was saying.
quote:
Originally posted by daniel mason
wikipedia?
Like I said to a work colleague recently, the 0-60 times are totally irrelevant, that is only the fist 5 seconds of any journey.
not refered to you mr whately! it was the other blurb on the thread
[Edited on 27/4/14 by daniel mason]
First 5? No.... The first 3!
But your right, totally irrelevant. It's good for pub talk and that's about it.
also I was referring to mr hodder not mr hoyle.
quote:
Originally posted by daniel mason
there was a 'brick shaped' westy at Aintree crossing the finishing line at over 140mph yesterday! not too shabby
the clock at Aintree was incorrect, the data logger said different. and mr hodder was 2nd ftd!
quote:
Originally posted by daniel mason
wikipedia?
quote:
Originally posted by daniel mason
not refered to you mr whately! it was the other blurb on the thread
quote:
Originally posted by daniel mason
also I was referring to mr hodder not mr hoyle.
). The
same power would barely see you past 130mph in a Seven! Aerodynamically, they're a bad joke.
if you cared to read and listen instead of talk,youd see the clock was wrong and the data logger was not. unless the driver was lying?
anyway unless you had a 90bhp aero car and a 260bhp 7 on the same track with the same tyres with the same driver on the same day its difficult to get
a realistic figure using a calculator and a pencil.
in the real world (competitive motorsport) a bec 7 can be a match for many high powered machinery,even on high speed circuits, although on a drag
strip maybe a drag car would be more suited
Going back to the op and advice for him.
I would say that you have probably seen enough evidence to tell you that these cars are not straight line machines.
How ever if you are looking for fun b Road driving or a track day car that will be one of the quickest cars at any day then a kit car is the thing for
you.
I brought mine for these two reasons. If I wanted b Road enjoyment I would of got an classic car with a soft top and if wanted balls out track time I
would of got a bike.
quote:
Originally posted by daniel mason
the clock at Aintree was incorrect, the data logger said different.
Even with the ZX10R turbo engine in my Mac 1 Worx, first gear is a bit too tall to get brilliant 0-60 times, once over about 20mph it's brutal right the way to the limiter in 6th!
its geared and logged at 143mph and was on the limiter way before finish line. and the clock was incorrect. it still was a lot more accurate than a guy with a calculator and pencil,which is more or less the same as a wild guess!
Even assuming that it might be 143MPH that Derek Hodder hit while passing the finish line, that car is a very high powered Honda CEC (well over 500BHP) so I'm at a loss to see your point, Daniel. Even crap aero can be pushed through the air with enough power. I hit 158MPH at Goodwood on the Lavant straight but even that does help the OP.
im well aware that a certain amount of power can push these cars onto high speeds.and didn't want this thread to turn sour. but sometimes when
certain people try to antagonise people on the forum,with made up facts (its been going on,on many forums for a number of years with certain people) I
feel someone should speak up.
a light bec should be very quick to 60mph which is what the op wanted to know. id suggest looking at sprint results and see which cars got off the
line quickest! apologies to the op.
mmmmmmmm, quickest off the line sprint times
What distance was that Jon? Surely not 64ft?
I honestly don't know, whatever they measure at Barkston heath, just went for a play having never driven the sprint circuit there before was
reasonably pleased with the results, oddly enough I have another somewhere I will have to dig out, blows the 4wd theory off the line out the window, 3
out of the top 3 times where posted by BECs admittedly one on slicks (not moi) not sure what engine was in the warner car bit I think (could be wrong)
that was bike too so that's 4 out of 4 then a bit of a gap to the rest ?
I just had the same engine and road legal tyres that saw BECs banned from the GOME 6 hour endurance event apparently to much speed differential,
I'll leave others to debate which way but will add when we entered we where belittled a somewhat with our rice burning tiny motors that
wouldn't even last 1/2 the event.
eta, just to put a little more meat on the bones, the GOME 6 hour event rules dictate 4 driver changes per hour but both drivers must be in the car on
the circuit at all times in other words 2 up for the whole event.
[Edited on 28/4/14 by Jon Ison]
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Allanson
Like I said to a work colleague recently, the 0-60 times are totally irrelevant, that is only the fist 5 seconds of any journey.
quote:
Originally posted by ian locostzx9rc2
4.5secs or 5.0 secs
quote:
Originally posted by Chalkey
quote:
Originally posted by ian locostzx9rc2
4.5secs or 5.0 secs
I'd be very surprised if any were that slow, they must weigh a ton or something must be wrong somewhere!
Mine is just over 400kg and does over 70mph in first gear :-)
quote:
Originally posted by Jon Ison
mmmmmmmm, quickest off the line sprint times
quote:
Originally posted by Jon Ison
I just had the same engine and road legal tyres that saw BECs banned from the GOME 6 hour endurance event apparently to much speed differential, I'll leave others to debate which way but will add when we entered we where belittled a somewhat with our rice burning tiny motors that wouldn't even last 1/2 the event.
eta, just to put a little more meat on the bones, the GOME 6 hour event rules dictate 4 driver changes per hour but both drivers must be in the car on the circuit at all times in other words 2 up for the whole event.
[Edited on 28/4/14 by Jon Ison]
quote:
Originally posted by jeffw
quote:
Originally posted by Jon Ison
I just had the same engine and road legal tyres that saw BECs banned from the GOME 6 hour endurance event apparently to much speed differential, I'll leave others to debate which way but will add when we entered we where belittled a somewhat with our rice burning tiny motors that wouldn't even last 1/2 the event.
eta, just to put a little more meat on the bones, the GOME 6 hour event rules dictate 4 driver changes per hour but both drivers must be in the car on the circuit at all times in other words 2 up for the whole event.
[Edited on 28/4/14 by Jon Ison]
Lol....you can't let that go, can you Jon.
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mackey
quote:
Originally posted by Chalkey
quote:
Originally posted by ian locostzx9rc2
4.5secs or 5.0 secs
I'd be very surprised if any were that slow, they must weigh a ton or something must be wrong somewhere!
Mine is just over 400kg and does over 70mph in first gear :-)
But what's your 0-60 time mate?
quote:
Originally posted by Chalkey
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mackey
quote:
Originally posted by Chalkey
quote:
Originally posted by ian locostzx9rc2
4.5secs or 5.0 secs
I'd be very surprised if any were that slow, they must weigh a ton or something must be wrong somewhere!
Mine is just over 400kg and does over 70mph in first gear :-)
But what's your 0-60 time mate?
mmm well my bum dyno tells me its quicker than my Exige I owned previously, so I guess sub 4 seconds. I would be very keen to have a go with one of the GPS gizmos to really be sure but at the end of the day, it is a track car, not a drag car so for me the 0-60 really is irrelevant but I'd still say - pretty damn quick!
One thing to look out for though if you are looking to purchase is what type of diff and diff ratio the car has as some will rev out at circa 100mph max. Mine will see approx. 135mph before bouncing off the rev limiter in 6th.
I'd go and try a few different cars to get a balanced view... For me they are very compromising on the road, very tiring unless your on some good twisty b-roads but its on track where it really comes to life.
Blue-printed ZX10R Superstock spec from Ex BSB Team
FlatShifter
Quaife LSD
R888
412Kg (admittedly the weight will go up considerably when I sit in it!)
[Edited on 28/4/14 by Chalkey]
you may of mentioned this elsewhere but what chassis is this?
0-62 in 3.4, 0-100 in 7.3, thats a 650kg car with a na engine. 155+mph.
quote:
Originally posted by franky
0-62 in 3.4, 0-100 in 7.3, thats a 650kg car with a na engine. 155+mph.
My F27 blade will hit 60 in 4.07 seconds, with the right tyres, tarmac & driver. It's lightweight (circa 490kg) being a narrowbody and having a live rear end. Not bad for a car with 130bhp. I've owned some very quick/fast cars over the years, and nothing 'feels' as quick as this to 60. After that, other cars (including my 200bhp diesel tintop) will blow it away in a straight line. As said, put a passenger in with me and it kills it, really knocks the edge off.
Setting aside the BEC/CEC thing for a moment
1. Kit cars feel much faster than normal cars
2. Only Journalist are able to match 0-60 times and the manufacture replaces the clutch after each test.
3. Most BECs will leave the vast majority of cars for Dead, on the road or on the track, until you get to silly speeds.
4. 0-60 times are like dyno printouts and car weight figures....makes us feel good but are probable mostly pub figures.
5. I can out drag most if not all 4wd cars in the dry but when it rains....4wd and traction control wins.
Get what you fancy and then enjoy it.
quote:
Originally posted by jeffw
quote:
Originally posted by Jon Ison
mmmmmmmm, quickest off the line sprint times
If that is 64ft it is a stunning time. I can do 2.2sec 64ft with cold tyres and around 1.9-2.0 with warm tyres. 1.8 is awesome.
quote:
Originally posted by Jon Ison
I just had the same engine and road legal tyres that saw BECs banned from the GOME 6 hour endurance event apparently to much speed differential, I'll leave others to debate which way but will add when we entered we where belittled a somewhat with our rice burning tiny motors that wouldn't even last 1/2 the event.
eta, just to put a little more meat on the bones, the GOME 6 hour event rules dictate 4 driver changes per hour but both drivers must be in the car on the circuit at all times in other words 2 up for the whole event.
[Edited on 28/4/14 by Jon Ison]
Slightly OT...What's the significance of the 60 mph..arbitrary or what?
^^ its the speed limit on most roads
quote:
but anything under 2.2 seconds on road tyres is very unusual!
quote:
Originally posted by Jon Ison
quote:
but anything under 2.2 seconds on road tyres is very unusual!
That's me very unusual, those times where on triple 8's down to wear bars but spun up to get some heat in them pre start.
The feel for grip v wheels pin I guess from years of autograss starts on slippery surfaces in a race where first into first corner usually wins helps.
My 60ft times are 2.5 -2.8 on road tyres and not much better on cheap track tyres . Had a fluke 1.8 second 60ft at Avon park last year and took .5 off my 1/4 time but never got under 2.0 since .
quote:
Originally posted by phelpsa
Your times are pretty spectacular too Jeff. Is that with A24 ZZRs?
My best is 2.04 secs with pretty much brand new A15 slicks, and I am consistently the fastest (to 64ft...) in the class. Even the top running mod Westfields on radial slicks with launch/traction control struggle to go below 2.1. Admittedly it is very surface dependent, but anything under 2.2 seconds on road tyres is very unusual!
quote:
Originally posted by mark chandler
Around 4 seconds if it has slicks and LSD fitted, 3 sounds like beer talk.
quote:
Originally posted by Fatgadget
Slightly OT...What's the significance of the 60 mph..arbitrary or what?
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mackey
Thanks for all the replys.went out again in the zx10.still the acceleration felt tame.my friend has a 400 bhp impreza and even when the massive weight difference is seems much quicker.i must say through the twistys the zx10 was quick
[Edited on 27/4/14 by Mr Mackey]