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Author: Subject: AJ30 ECU information
Scratchy74

posted on 12/6/16 at 05:17 PM Reply With Quote
AJ30 ECU information

Hi there, this is my first topic on here! I have a few that came cheaply and would like to use them in my banger racers for cheap reliable power.

A friend who is good with wiring was tasked with reducing the original loom down to a minimum (he does this with ease for many vehicles) but for this engine it has become a real pain. So my question is what are guys using this engine doing with regards to wiring? Is it possible to cut down an original loom or will I have to look into aftermarket systems and possibly removing the VVT?

Would it be possible to fit Mondeo st parts to remove the VVT if this is required?

Can anyone recommend an ECU/system that I can buy with a generic loom which I assume I can simply splice the jags plugs onto to create a plug and play loom. Ideally retaining the VVT because as you can imagine for my application engines often get damaged so ease of changing out for another engine and running them otherwise stock is what I'm really looking for.


Thanks in advance for your help

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Badger_McLetcher

posted on 12/6/16 at 05:38 PM Reply With Quote
Welcome to the forums!
I'm building a Haynes Roadster with an AJ30 in it at the moment, however I've gone for an aftermarket ECU (Emerald) and a scratch built loom. I was put off trying to use the original ECU as it was so tied into everything else and complex.

I am using the VVT on mine as Emerald has a VVT output; the Jag VVT system is quite similar to the BMW Vanos one and is a two state system (on or off). You should be able to leave it disconnected and only (if memory serves correctly) lose a bit of low down torque.

Emerald do a generic 6 cylinder loom which may go some way to what you want.





If disfunction is a function, then I must be some kind of genius.

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Scratchy74

posted on 12/6/16 at 05:52 PM Reply With Quote
Yes with the original ECU that's what we found. Very complex!

I've seen the emerald ecus mentioned on here and I see they are readily available online.

That's interesting information on the aj30s VVT. I have a ST 170 nodiz/VVT pro set up (carb) which works very Nicely. What I learnt about that VVT system is it needs progressive control. In fact if I rememeber rightly the VVT actually retards up the Rev range. This is why people using a simple "switch on" output from their aftermarket ECU were not getting good results at all. This promoted the development of the VVT pro controller by ME in the first place.

Does anyone know if the v3 microsquirt ECU would be suitable? It's a very affordable package. ECU with loom for £325 on eBay.

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big_wasa

posted on 12/6/16 at 06:15 PM Reply With Quote
Does the 3.0 x type share the vvt with the S type ?

The x type uses the ford ecu. These are not that hard to have running out of the donor.

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Badger_McLetcher

posted on 12/6/16 at 06:42 PM Reply With Quote
I think the X-Type is a standard Ford unit unfortunately, not the Jag version.

I've got some manuals and more info on my other computer given to me by others on this forum; I'll have a look into the VVT thing when I get back if they haven't replied yet





If disfunction is a function, then I must be some kind of genius.

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Scratchy74

posted on 12/6/16 at 07:16 PM Reply With Quote
Yes please if you could
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Badger_McLetcher

posted on 12/6/16 at 09:25 PM Reply With Quote
So according to one of the manuals it is indeed a two stage system which advances the inlet cams 30 degrees when activated.

From the manual:

"From the oil control valve, the flow is via the thrust bearing cap, through drillings in the camshaft and then through
the hollow fixing bolt which secures the VVT unit. Drain holes are provided at the rear (camside) face of the VVT unit
for any residual oil which has seeped past the piston.
With the oil control valve open, oil pressure on the helical drive piston is increased, rotating the cams to the
advanced position. When the valve closes, oil pressure reduces and the return spring pushes the piston back to the
fully retarded position.
The oil control valve is controlled by a 300Hz PWM signal from the PCM which sets it to either the fully open or fully
closed position."





If disfunction is a function, then I must be some kind of genius.

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Scratchy74

posted on 13/6/16 at 07:42 AM Reply With Quote
That's useful information.

So anybody have experience with the basic microsquirt ECU? Does it have this capability?

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Pojo

posted on 13/6/16 at 08:47 AM Reply With Quote
For an ECU give Dave a call at Canems, he has experience with the AJ30 in a BMW rally car (weird but true), is very helpfull and he made up a loom for mine with long leads so that i could cut and terminate as required. It has VVt capability and uses the jaguar cylinder head temp sender as well. Dump the water pump and use an electric one. the engine would then be a very quick change especially if you bought an engine and gearbox as spares and changed them as one unit. Cheap as chips.

Good luck

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40inches

posted on 13/6/16 at 11:06 AM Reply With Quote
I have used the Megasquirt 2 extra £425, set up for semi sequential and wasted spark. The VVT can be switched by the MS, I simply used it to switch a relay, works fine.
Micro squirt would be ok using batch fuelling and wasted spark, the VVT is triggered at around 5200 rpm and could be by a rev limiter, or anything triggered by RPM.

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Scratchy74

posted on 13/6/16 at 04:33 PM Reply With Quote
Thanks for all the help I now am starting to get an idea of how to go with this. I messaged a supplier of the microsquirt sand they confirmed that there will be the ability to activate the VVT since it's a switch on type.

What are the benefits between sequential and batch fuelling? I guess the difference is obvious but why would you go for one type over the over?

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Neville Jones

posted on 13/6/16 at 05:49 PM Reply With Quote
I was going to suggest a Megasquirt setup when you first put this thread up. But I didn't think it fitted in with the banger racing ethos and particular train of thought.. How wrong can a man be! The days of the V6 Ford planted into whatever car you had and a cut and shut prop must be long gone.

Anyway, contact the guy at ExtraEfi, http://www.extraefi.co.uk he's extremely helpful, and I think he posts on here occasionally.

You'll probably get a useable map off the MS site, or ExtraEfi will probably have something to get you going. There's plenty of maps about on the 'net.

The beauty of the MS (or any after market ecu really), is that it's easily transplanted from car to car, and even across different makes of engine. The great thing about MS is that there are people using it all over the world, and maps for just about every engine are available, somewhere. If you decide on a different make, then you'll be able to swap across.

The generic maps that are floating about will get you going with fairly good power, as you aren't looking for that last 1hp for top speed.

Isn't there a rolling road MS specialist on here? West country somewhere I seem to remember.

Cheers,
Nev.

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Scratchy74

posted on 14/6/16 at 07:29 PM Reply With Quote
Those days aren't quite gone, still a lot of guys using ford v6s, but the current trend is to use the 4 cylinder 2.3 duratec found in the "frog eye" Granada/Scorpio and also in some galaxy people carriers. I don't have either of those options already and I'm sure you can imagine the costs start racking up: galaxy/frog engine: 150, box: 150, inlet 250, bits to rwd it (if not out of a frog in the first place) maybe 200. I would already have a good carb and ECU but that would mean stripping off my Mondeo each time so would want more of these too.

I've always tried to go my own way with engines and so on rather than follow the crowd. I had a play with the st 170 engine which was starting to go well but only lasted for half a season and they closed up the rules to disallow its use in the Mondeos. My main unlimited banger car of choice is the XJ40/X300 jaguar running the original engines (manual) on twin jag carbs and a dissy. Many used to dismiss these cars as bangers now we see them start to be adopted often like me on original engines. Not saying that's all down to me but once a guy has proven something others will always give it a go. So that's what I'm thinking for the AJ30 engine. There's no simple carburettor option unless you are very keen to fabricate an inlet for it, but what you do have is a compact powerful throwaway engine which I'm sure once I've got my head round an aftermarket injection ECU should be a bit of a weapon. Boasting 100 more hp than the aforementioned ford engines. When 3 s types have come to me for the cost of one ford engine... It's got to be worth a crack!

The s types themselves with their ally suspension set ups really don't look like they will lend themselves to banger racing. But down the line I will give one a go! Why not eh!

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Scratchy74

posted on 7/4/17 at 11:53 PM Reply With Quote
Little update on the s type engine project.

Eventually I finally managed to find time to have a proper look at this. Initially I had planned to get a megasquirt 3 ECU, but through racing I got friendly with Phil from Lambley developments and decided to go with the Canems ECU after all. Both Phil and Dave from canems have been really helpful with regards to the wiring and other little tips and pointers. Since Canems have some experience with the 3.0 s type engine they were able to supply the ECU with the correct firmware installed and even a map pretty close to what I would be looking for. What's more and to be honest worth its weight in gold was a wiring guide sheet! Not sure these will be available for every application but no doubt if Dave can help he will help which is very reassuring when thinking of giving aftermarket management a go.

What Proved to be the biggest hurdle so far was one I didn't really foresee. I realised the 3.0 is a fly by wire type engine so I had kept back the inlet manifold off of a 2.1 v6 x type I had previously raced since I noticed at the time that it has a throttle cable. This proved not to be a perfect fit, but furthermore the pipe sections of the inlet were rather thin as was the throttle body itself. So even before unboxing the ECU I had realised that I would have to get an inlet made. Using the esprit engine bay pictures as inspiration I decided to make it up myself. Believe it or not this has worked and it goes like hell!

Does anyone know what kind of fuel pressure is required for the injection system? At the moment for testing purposes I have a simple injection pump (believe it's a bmw pump) wired so it's effectively always on. My question here is would it be ok to run this way? Or would the pressure between the pump and the injectors just grow and grow until a pipe blows off? Or burn the pump out? If I know the pressure required then I can out a t piece in line and going back to the return on the tank with a pressure regulator set to the correct pressure, therefore allowing the excess pressure to return to the tank?

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40inches

posted on 8/4/17 at 12:01 AM Reply With Quote
3 bar is the normal pressure, I dead ended the fuel rail, as you suggest, it works fine
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