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Author: Subject: Pinto Running Stupidly hot
serieslandy

posted on 28/11/13 at 08:06 PM Reply With Quote
Pinto Running Stupidly hot

Hi guys, I always feel like I'm fighting a loosing battle.

After 4 years I've managed to get my engine running but I can't seem to get it running happily.

Its currently plumbed like this:
Waterpump-> bottom rad, T'd upto bottom outlet on the headertank
Top hose T'd to header tank.
Thermostat housing -> top rad.
Small connection rad -> header tank
waterpump small outlet ->autochoke -> inlet manifold.
small outlet on thermostat housing blanked (as it was in the sierra)

I had the engine running last night for about 10 mins and it went to 110deg and carried on rising.
The top of the rad was very very hot, the bottom not so bad. The fan never kicked in once.
I undid the header tank cap slightly with a tee towel and got lots of air coming out of the top hose, I kept on doing this letting the engine cool when it reached 110deg as I don't want to damage it.

Only things I can think of is there is a lot of air within the engine. (how do I get it out?)
The thermostat doesn't work very well (it's as it came out of the sierra, is it worth putting a 82deg one in as per
this thread)
the header tank is too low, the rim on the tank is roughly level with the top of the thermostat housing.

I hope someone can help as I'm stumped.

PS the pinto is mainly standard, carb and inlet manifold are stock.

Steve


[Edited on 28/11/13 by serieslandy]

[Edited on 28/11/13 by serieslandy]

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MP3C

posted on 28/11/13 at 08:25 PM Reply With Quote
I had a very similar problem to this and took me all afternoon to sort. The problem was the pump wasn't actually pumping the coolant round as something had blocked the hose that comes from the radiator back to the header tank. I did the same as you - taking the thermostat out and letting the air out (kept coming out and no idea where it came from) but wasn't the problem took the hose off and there was a bit of gunk in the bit sticking out of the header tank that the coolant pipe fits on.

Don't don't know if it is the same problem but check when you are running the engine that the coolant is being pumped round and back into the header tank.

Hope this helps.

Matt

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snapper

posted on 28/11/13 at 08:26 PM Reply With Quote
You need water level in header tank higher than top hose and inlet manifold/ head water feed or air gets in and ruins the cooling
The 82 degree thermostat helps but not until you sort water level
It's called a header tank because it should provide a head of water





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davidimurray

posted on 28/11/13 at 08:58 PM Reply With Quote
I had similar problems when I first setup my car but I think that was mainly down to my initial pipe layout.

Just popped down the garage to check my car which is setup like this :-
Rover 25 header tank
Header tank bot hose - tee into bottom rad hose
Water pump - rad bottom hose
Heater connection on water pump - inlet manifold
Top rad hose - thermostat housing ( the original rubber tee off the top hose has been blocked off)
Little bleed on thermostat housing - top connection on header tank

With this setup I find it self bleeds the system, also the small flow through the little thermostat connection means you get a flow of hot water across the thermostat which ensures the thermostat opens.

With this setup the car warms up nicely and will sit stationary, bonnet on at 2500 rpm with the fan just kicking in and out happily for 10 mins. It will idle forever without problems.





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britishtrident

posted on 28/11/13 at 08:59 PM Reply With Quote
Header tank level is fine the water level only needs to be at the same level as the highest point of the water ways on the engine or rad.

Before doing major surgery check the ignition timing at idle using a strobe timing light as nothing makes an engine boil faster that the ignition timing being too retarded.

You could also unblank the connection below the thermostat and tee this into one of the connections to the top of the header tank or rad.


Best easy way to control the fan is a switch mounted in adaptor one of the hoses either the top hose or the by by-pass hose.





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mark chandler

posted on 28/11/13 at 09:10 PM Reply With Quote
That little outlet you have blanked off above the thermostat is there to bubble off steam, it needs a small bore pipe into the header as above or the steam will push the water down in the head causing overheating.

Regards Mark

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serieslandy

posted on 28/11/13 at 09:11 PM Reply With Quote
Cheers for the replys. Timing was set with a strobe at4deg retarded and I checked it tonight and it's the same.

I think I'm going to try and raise the tank up as far as possible as I have some 16mm hose and a spare joiner, it should be a quick check to see if that works.

I'll also check that there is nothing blocking any of the hoses but I tried to get the water pump hose off last night and couldn't.

Does anyone have any other ideas?

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garyo

posted on 28/11/13 at 09:12 PM Reply With Quote
Do you trust your gauges/senders - where did they come from? Are they a matched/suited pair?
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MikeRJ

posted on 28/11/13 at 10:04 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by serieslandy
Cheers for the replys. Timing was set with a strobe at4deg retarded and I checked it tonight and it's the same.



By retarded, do you mean 4 degrees After Top Dead Centre? If so that is very retarded and will very likely be causing, or at least greatly contributing to your overheating.

From memory the static timing on a standard Pinto should be around 12 degrees Before Top Dead Centre.

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britishtrident

posted on 28/11/13 at 10:39 PM Reply With Quote
At 4 deg after TDC I would expect the exhaust manifilod to to glow red hot.





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serieslandy

posted on 28/11/13 at 10:52 PM Reply With Quote
Whoops, it's at 4deg bTDC or at TDC I can't remember but it's the last marker as the pulley turns. I'll have a look tomorrow night if I get chance.

Gauge is race technology dash 2 and standard ford temp sender. Calibrated by hand from 4-97 deg. Although it was reading -8 at garage temp when I started tonight.

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Davg

posted on 28/11/13 at 10:53 PM Reply With Quote
Steve is the picture above as you have it set up just now?





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serieslandy

posted on 28/11/13 at 11:03 PM Reply With Quote
Yup from eariler this evening
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Davg

posted on 28/11/13 at 11:08 PM Reply With Quote
Ah you may have a doh moment here then! You have sod all driving your water pump
You appear to be missing the pulley from the pump and as such would account for the non circulation of the wet stuff.

Cheers D

Time to re do with appropriate pulley and your alternator belt.





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serieslandy

posted on 28/11/13 at 11:11 PM Reply With Quote
Doh. What a twat I am. That will be going back on then. Good job I didn't throw it away.
I did look at a pic eariler and think that I never put that pulley back on.

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Davg

posted on 28/11/13 at 11:15 PM Reply With Quote
Never mind should have you sorted once that's done . Cheers D






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serieslandy

posted on 28/11/13 at 11:18 PM Reply With Quote
Cheers D. Hopefully that will sort it. Back to the motor factors again. I seem to be in there every week now.
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Nickp

posted on 29/11/13 at 07:51 AM Reply With Quote
Brilliant!! That has made me chuckle this morning Always look for the obvious first
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HowardB

posted on 29/11/13 at 08:07 AM Reply With Quote
that is great news, however an earlier comment about the fan not cutting in would have me checking the fan control too,.. pump and fan will make for a happy engine, ...





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johnemms

posted on 29/11/13 at 08:33 AM Reply With Quote
I saw that pulley missing and thought it was a trick question!!





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serieslandy

posted on 29/11/13 at 08:45 AM Reply With Quote
I'm going to check the fan as we'll, I was surprised it never kicked in as I think the switch was about an 80deg one but it is half way down the rad.
I'll also check the wiring as I have the rad stat taking the relay to ground.

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Philwaters7

posted on 29/11/13 at 09:41 AM Reply With Quote
Was the rad getting hot - with no pump the switch in the rad might not have been seeing enough temp to kick in...?





Phil Waters

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serieslandy

posted on 29/11/13 at 10:29 AM Reply With Quote
When I tried it the first night it was, I'm guessing the switch isn't a low enough temperature.
Last night it wasn't hot. Got a belt this morning but can't fit it untill tomorrow, as we have a family christmas meal tonight.

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MP3C

posted on 29/11/13 at 12:08 PM Reply With Quote
FYI when my pipe was blocking the flow of the coolant the fan didn't kick in for me either. Top of the rad was really hot but no fan. When the coolant started flowing again the fan kicked in as normal so I wouldn't change anything if I was you until you have it working properly and then see if needs changing if it doesn't work properly.

Matt

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serieslandy

posted on 29/11/13 at 06:50 PM Reply With Quote
We'll after my stupidity I fitted a new (longer) belt tonight and the engine was running a bit better. Got it to 96deg with a bit of effort and 3000rpm's roughly (no gauge yet). I also moved the tank up by 70mm and it seems much happier. Need to secure it properly now.


The fan didn't kick in once but I tested that my wiring works. Either there is a break between the switch and a crimp or it doesn't work.

Cheers for the help guys.

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