Still exists,

Went out for a quick (well turned into 3 hours) blat as the suns out, called in a popular layby near Matlock for a coffee where 3 other "proper" 7's happened to be parked up amongst the plentiful bikes, got into conversation with several bikers who showed an interest in the bike engine install only for one of the "proper" owners to stick his 2p in and comment "pha its not a proper one"

Why ? I think the other two guys where a bit embarrassed to be honest and didn't get involved, didn't go down to well either when one of the bikers told him, "well I know which Id sooner have and it aint yours" I think he was a tad peeved that the cheap copy was getting plenty of attention whilst his mega buck proper jobbie was been ignored

Not encountered this for a good few years now but I'm afraid it does still exist.

Have seen this at a local Westfield meet I attended with my m8 in his MK indy, and his indy put the majority of the Westfields to shame looking at the build quality's and finish!!!

Were the ones you encountered Caterhams?

Its still rife unfortunately
I was at curborough sprint track a few weeks ago watching the lotus 7 club
Parked up in my westfield and they actually overt their eyes so as not to even look at it
Standing at the catering shed ime glad they didnt speak
What a stuck up load of prats they were
Do they not realise that caterhams are kit cars too

To be fair the other two guys where embarrassed by him, but yes they where all three in catering vans, nice looking cars they where too I'm sure we could/would have had a lot in common and this one guy got past the badge and shared a bit of tyre kicking instead.

I've had this as well, was talking to guy about his Super light r400 and asked how heavy.. About 650kg.. then I pointed at mine and said super light? Mines only 520..

That was the end of that chat....

some people have a very strange mind set.
yes they may like caterhams etc, they may like hondas...

me, I like cars
i dont care on the make, if someone has put some thought and effort into a car then im a big fan, even if i wouldnt own it myself (within limits)

to make a comment like that seems ridiculous.

I get it all the time from the E Type purists, because mine has alternate carbs, edis and Megajolt, modified cooling fans, and more, can't wait to get the EFI sorted......

Its usually 'non owners', so asking for a look at theirs, and how it should be shuts them up....

[Edited on 12/10/14 by r1_pete]

I would actually say I have experienced actions from Caterham drivers that contradict this, but its been in a different setting. I have had quite a few older gents (standard Caterham owner ) come up to me and ask about my car on track days. They normally ask what it is and what engine its got before pointing out which car they were in and mentioning how "well" I was going. All very pleasant and nice track day chat.

I think its because the Striker really does look different (like MNR) and I am normally lapping faster.My car is also a mess, bordering poor condition on the outside, so I guess they see that I am not pretending I have a "real one" . I just play it down saying that I am still trying to improve the chassis and live the dream!!

TBH I am not the biggest Caterham Seven fan. I like the LM style car but I am very comfortable with my se7en and how much its cost VS pace. Something that road users dont value as highly.

I don't quite understand though, I didn't think Caterham's or Westfields were 'proper' either. Neither have got a Lotus badge, so saying they're a proper 7 just makes no sense. Are they tracing it back to some dim and distant event where someone bought the rights to make a 7-a-like?

Went to a Caterham meeting with a mate who has a Westfield and I was in a bike engined striker and most of the Caterham owners where very interested in the striker as most of them didn't know what was and there was less bike engined cars about in 2003 ,recently at a trackday I have a mix of positive and negative conversations with Caterham drivers maybe they where upset that I was quicker than them!!!now I'm toyota powered.

It's not just other 7's it's engines too!

A few years ago I heard from a friend about his mate who bought a Vauxhall 8v engine Caterham to see if he liked it. He had the intention of quickly upgrading to a new SL if he used it/liked it.

One Caterham meeting was enough to put him off when the other owners turned their noses up at him and his car as it wasn't K Series powered. Very odd!

How many of them could fix or modify them ?

I've not encountered much snobbery yet, but my car is usually in pieces

I'd quite like to convert a Caterham to diesel and turn up at a meet

That's been a thought of mine also...

A diesel powered kit car
I think it would be awesome, as long as you don't go daft with the power/torque

has anyone tried this yet?

quote:

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Originally posted by Matt21
That's been a thought of mine also...

A diesel powered kit car
I think it would be awesome, as long as you don't go daft with the power/torque

has anyone tried this yet?

---

But caterhams aren't proper 7s, ie not a lotus, so I don't see why he thinks its any different

caterham bought the 7 from lotus to continue making it, technically they are the 'new originals' I guess...

just found a thread discussing diesel kit cars and everyone was moaning about the noise. I had a 'fettled' mk2 seat leon 2.0tdi, with a straight through stainless exhaust and it sounded absolutely bonkers!! it wasn't loud, but just sounded like a jet

Its inevitable. You spend a shed load of money so you never gonna be happy when someone else has paid a fraction of that for a fake, be it a gicci handbag, poss aftershave, amrani suit or catteringham.

I had a bit of this in Helmsley, another bike meeting spot.
I stopped for a brew with my mate in my MNR, I saw a Westfield over the road and thought great, another 7 esqe car, I'll have a chat - you don't see that many round here. I went to raise my hand to wave, made eye contact with the owner, he just turned his back on me - I thought f**k off then stuck up t**t.
He didn't look the sort who got his finger nails dirty building.

Badge snobbery is rife....and having a Robin Hood I've encountered it many times in the last 11 years ...and on this forum as well so it's ironic to see this thread appear.....

I'm a petrol head as much as anyone, and a skilled designer and engineer to go with it.....but it seems that just because I dont go out and buy the most expensive parts and bolt them onto a more modern chassis, I'm deemed the bottom of the food chain (so to speak).

quote:

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Originally posted by Matt21
That's been a thought of mine also...

A diesel powered kit car
I think it would be awesome, as long as you don't go daft with the power/torque

has anyone tried this yet?

---

quote:

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Originally posted by richardm6994 , I'm deemed the bottom of the food chain (so to speak).

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jon Ison

quote:

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Originally posted by richardm6994 , I'm deemed the bottom of the food chain (so to speak).

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I raise you locost, lower down the food chain than RH

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quote:

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Originally posted by Matt21
just found a thread discussing diesel kit cars and everyone was moaning about the noise. I had a 'fettled' mk2 seat leon 2.0tdi, with a straight through stainless exhaust and it sounded absolutely bonkers!! it wasn't loud, but just sounded like a jet

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Sorry I have to throw this in
I have a Robin Hood and have seen badge snobbery on this site

quote:

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Originally posted by snapper
Sorry I have to throw this in
I have a Robin Hood and have seen badge snobbery on this site

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quote:

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Anyone who has the knackers to drive round in a contraption they have built in their shed gets the thumbs up from me.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by Matt21
That's been a thought of mine also...

A diesel powered kit car
I think it would be awesome, as long as you don't go daft with the power/torque

has anyone tried this yet?

---

I find that Caterham owners seem to have complex and have to try to prove what they have is best at every turn. It's easier to just ignore them.

I once ended up on a Caterham track day at Castle Combe in my old BMW 320 track hack, myself and a guy with a scrappy ward rescued Fiat Brava were the only tin tops there, at lunch time the course clerk/organiser asked us to keep away from the Caterhams as many of the Caterham owners said that we were bullying our way past them. Anyone who has a Caterham on track and can't keep up with a £250 20 year old BMW estate and rusty Fiat Brava on budget tyres is a bit special.

My very first post on this site........I dared to suggest that I thought that the quality of the MK Indy I now own was as good as both the Westfield and the Caterham that I had owned in the past..........greeted by another person who replied that he , laughed out loud , because I made that suggestion , then somehow justified this by saying that both of my previous vehicles must have been poor examples..........so yes I am afraid badge snobbery is alive and unwell on this site too!!!!!!

Dont worry about the carbon fibre jockys they drive allsorts of cars what you need is a hosson boula

quote:

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Originally posted by Matt21

me, I like cars
i dont care on the make, if someone has put some thought and effort into a car then im a big fan, even if i wouldnt own it myself (within limits) to make a comment like that seems ridiculous.

---

All snobbery is are the insecurities of the person who makes the snide comments. It is alive and well in all walks of life.

I have seen people look down their noses at Robin Hoods for example, but to build one of those takes a bit more skill than other kit cars as they were never as developed as more expensive kits were, that in my mind lifts the builder somewhat and the acheivment. The same way as building your own chassis is proper engineering so why someone who has just bought something should feel a cut above is stupid.

There was an article in the Practical Classic mag where they were saying why do some feel the need to always aspire to an expensive classic, is it so they fell their status has gone up?

I like engineering, if it has an engine and at least one wheel, then I treat everyone the same. If people want to be snobby with me it is their loss not mine

I think it all depends on wether you wear your car or want something that is yours and indivdual me i like them all and have seen some very good build quality cars of all makes i once had somebody looking over my carbon fibre mirrors and admiring them never looked at rest of car they are fake rubbish cheap but lite

So it seems that its just general snobbery then,not really badge related
Most 7 owners are great blokes,a few are assholes
Ive got a westfield and would never turn my nose up at anyone elses car
Ime interested in what theyve got in it,did they build it etc - not how much it cost
There are owners on the westfield forum that tirn tbeir noses up at other westfields if its not got 300bhp and trick gearbox
Others will bend over backwards to help you out
You think 7s are bad,have a chat to an ultima owner !!!

I had this at a track day a month or two ago.

One guy with an R500, two with CSR's. All of them had this attitude around them in the morning when looking at my car, they wouldn't talk to me but happily walked around it pointing at bits in a huddle and discussing!

Over herd one of the guys saying - Has it got slicks on it to make him go faster to keep up?

Anyway, out on track - The R500 Managed 4 laps before red flagging the session after the throttle cable snapped, and the CSR's got a lesson on being overtaken... numerous times!

After coming back in, there mood had changed.... Asking what engine it had in it, and who set it up, as it was so flat through the corners.... Left me smiling for the rest of the day.

Obviously, whilst walking around the car being critical, they missed the effing big turbo..

quote:

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Originally posted by jwhatley

Over herd one of the guys saying - Has it got slicks on it to make him go faster to keep up?

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quote:

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Badge snobbery is rife....and having a Robin Hood I've encountered it many times in the last 11 years ...and on this forum as well so it's ironic to see this thread appear.....

---

since mine's not on the road yet I've not really met any "real 7" owners yet....

but I have already come across some engine snobbery with a few petrolheads when discussing what I'm (very slowly) building
I've found that quite a few people who aren't involved in kitcars seem to have heard of Dax Rush's and get very excited until I say mines got a pinto in it - then some of them have just shaken there heads and walked away with that 'its not even worth speaking to you anymore' look....

I'm well used to the 'boat anchor' jokes, but to these folk a dax rush just isn't worth bothering with unless its got a 4.0 V8 / cossie YB / turbo busa

quote:

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Originally posted by spaximusI have seen people look down their noses at Robin Hoods for example, but to build one of those takes a bit more skill than other kit cars as they were never as developed as more expensive kits were, that in my mind lifts the builder somewhat and the achievement.

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Ive taken this from a Caterham & Lotus 7 Owners Facebook page..


Welcome to the Caterham & Lotus 7 Owners Group.

'Please feel free to post photographs, information, 7 related items for sale, news and views.

Please note that this is a group for Seven owners - Westfield's and Locost cars are not Sevens.

Please keep interaction with other users friendly and respectful. Have fun!!'


Now I understand that they want to keep it to caterhams and lotus's.. but to say that westfield etc aren't 7's is a pretty moronic statement!

Mark.

quote:

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Originally posted by MsD
Ive taken this from a Caterham & Lotus 7 Owners Facebook page..


Welcome to the Caterham & Lotus 7 Owners Group.

'Please feel free to post photographs, information, 7 related items for sale, news and views.

Please note that this is a group for Seven owners - Westfield's and Locost cars are not Sevens.

Please keep interaction with other users friendly and respectful. Have fun!!'


Now I understand that they want to keep it to caterhams and lotus's.. but to say that westfield etc aren't 7's is a pretty moronic statement!

Mark.

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quote:

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Originally posted by MsD

Now I understand that they want to keep it to caterhams and lotus's.. but to say that westfield etc aren't 7's is a pretty moronic statement!

Mark.

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To be fair, Jon's car is embarrassing...



















...I'm embarassed every time it dissapears into the distance in front of me.

I agree Scoots mind you i have an f27 and go out for rides on my own

quote:

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Only Lotus and and Caterham made Sevens.

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showing your age again there andy

quote:

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Originally posted by bigfoot4616
showing your age again there andy

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I am going to take a wheel of mine the trike boys seem friendly

I used to have fun on an Elise site suggesting that the VX220 was a Lotus given it was made in Hethel and the engine had been worked on by Lotus (unlike the bog standard K series in the Elise). I had people say that categorically, the badge on the front was more important than the car underneath it. Mind you, you only had to say 'S2 is better than S1' and you'd get a 10 page flamewar.

I've seen a lot of bodge snobbery in the past, I once used gaffa tape for a quick fix and my friend turned his nose up at me. Apparently I 'should have used zip ties'. There's no pleasing some people.

quote:

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Originally posted by scudderfish

I used to have fun on an Elise site suggesting that the VX220 was a Lotus given it was made in Hethel and the engine had been worked on by Lotus (unlike the bog standard K series in the Elise). I had people say that categorically, the badge on the front was more important than the car underneath it. Mind you, you only had to say 'S2 is better than S1' and you'd get a 10 page flamewar.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by scudderfish
I used to have fun on an Elise site suggesting that the VX220 was a Lotus given it was made in Hethel and the engine had been worked on by Lotus (unlike the bog standard K series in the Elise). I had people say that categorically, the badge on the front was more important than the car underneath it. Mind you, you only had to say 'S2 is better than S1' and you'd get a 10 page flamewar.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by mcerd1

quote:

---

Originally posted by scudderfish
I used to have fun on an Elise site suggesting that the VX220 was a Lotus given it was made in Hethel and the engine had been worked on by Lotus (unlike the bog standard K series in the Elise). I had people say that categorically, the badge on the front was more important than the car underneath it. Mind you, you only had to say 'S2 is better than S1' and you'd get a 10 page flamewar.

---

a girl I know was going on about her new audi A3

I commented that it was probably quite good as it was basically the same as a new golf that I'd just driven, but with all the trim and toys thrown in

she was not happy, told me it was nothing like an VW and didn't speak to me for weeks after that

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quote:

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Originally posted by richardm6994
Badge snobbery is rife....and having a Robin Hood I've encountered it many times in the last 11 years ...and on this forum as well so it's ironic to see this thread appear.....

I'm a petrol head as much as anyone, and a skilled designer and engineer to go with it.....but it seems that just because I dont go out and buy the most expensive parts and bolt them onto a more modern chassis, I'm deemed the bottom of the food chain (so to speak).

---

I drive and own a Lotus Elise and even I have experienced this at track days from 911 owners, I would be much much happier to talk to a chap who has built a car, no matter what they drove, who built that car from scratch. I will find that person more interesting 9 times out of 10 to talk to, than 'mr stockbroker' who wants to play race driver at the weekend in his off-the-shelf Caterham.

Yes I drive an Elise, but I have built spaceframe imps, clio's, old beemers, old toyota's, 106's, and i have appreciated all these car's for their own wonderful imperfections and flaws, and have enjoyed each of them in different ways. The Elise was always my idea automotive perfection, and I always wanted to own one at some point. Not for it's badge, it's the Colin Chapman idealization of what motoring is about that the Elise represents and I never see myself parting ways with it.

The main reason i never see myself parting ways with it is because of the smile it puts on my face, and no matter what other people thought about what i was driving that was doing that, I wouldn't bat an eyelid as to what they thought, good or bad. Enjoy your motor's and enjoy life. It's too short not to.

The 'mr stockbroker' reference was in no way meant to insult any one on here that may do such a job and build their own car's (full marks to you if you do). I was trying to paint a picture of a stereotype so to speak, that can afford to treat a car in the same manner he treats his Ralph Lauren shirt, a status symbol, it is still made in similar factory's in East Asia as a shirt from Primark and yet happy to pay 3 to 4 times as much for its 'perceived' quality. But that's a story for another day!

well i feel i would like to add my 10p worth to the mix.

"Those who can build, Those who cant buy"

quote:

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Originally posted by baz-R
well i feel i would like to add my 10p worth to the mix.

"Those who can build, Those who cant buy"

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I would think the actual badge on my car may get some purists riled up then.



That and my Reg is H7 BYO. Oh well.

Cheers
Stot

I remember when i got mine through iva and on the way home though i have built a whole car badge didnt matter then and still dont now i have met so many builders and enjoyed thier cars and crack one of my best friends has a westfield and another had an r 500 bloke down the village has a robin hood great guys all of them if you live long enough you will met great people and also some arsholes take you pick which ones you become friends with

Not ventured out in my "7 esque" striker as yet, but very close to completion

But i know any purists will hate the mongrel its become, Vauxhaull engined, Caterham Wheels, Sylva Chassis, Raw bodywork & a vauxhall badge upfront,


But Im sure I'm not the only one who actually enjoys being classed the underdog.

I recently sold my MK1 Leon Cupra, pretty heavily breathed on, and pushing close to 245bhp.. the amount of jibes i got over 6 years of ownership for "its not a Cupra R though is it.." off other seat owners...quite sad really.... funny when on a nice B road how it was set up it left them standing...

Any monkey can drive fast in a straight line, I'm a firm believer that a driver makes a car as much as a car makes a driver.. irrelevant of what make it is.