Hello again, after my first engine start I must solve "few" problems :-(

Few data about my engine:
Engine Pinto 2.0, MJL unit with TPS sensor (Chestersportcars) and ZX6R carbs and exhaust manifold(Kitpartsdirect).


When I started engine - after few rpm it start but runing very bad and with lot of smoke and only under full throttle and sometimes with back fire to the inlet and carbs (carbs start firing!!! - Im using Facet Fuel Pump Road with 1.5 - 2.5 Psi but fuel pump still runing - and fuel still splattering from carbs - I hope that this problem I can solve with fuel pressure regulator or some pressure switch which disconnect fuel pump when is pressur to big)
But question is what can make backfiring - bad spark advance? Please, see pictures under if I have good instaled VR sensor on good position.











MJL using map for Pingo directly from Chestersportcar.
Carbs with inlet are directly from Kitpartsdirect set up for Pint... I hope.

Where can be a problem?

Thank you everybody for any idea.
... and sorry for my english...

Regards,

Petr

[Edited on 28/11/08 by black.viper]

Mate - that's the least of your worries, you've put the steering wheel on the wrong side!

wonder if the VR sensor could be a little closer to the trigger. i think its supposed to be about 1mm? don't think that would cause the backfiring in the carbs though. might help it run a bit smoother though

quote:

---

Originally posted by bartonp
Mate - that's the least of your worries, you've put the steering wheel on the wrong side!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by blakep82
wonder if the VR sensor could be a little closer to the trigger. i think its supposed to be about 1mm? don't think that would cause the backfiring in the carbs though. might help it run a bit smoother though

---

my thinking is, if its closer it may give a better signal to where the crank is, and give more reliable timing.

Sounds like you have a similar problem to one I had with the carbs, are the slides lifting when you open the throttle? if not the carb tops/diaphragm arent sealing properly.

If you have fuel spluttering out of the carbs when not running it will never run properly, check the needle valves in the carbs. Which Facet pump are you using? if its the cylindrical type they're far too much pressure for bike carbs.

I would aim for 1.0 - 1.5mm spacing between the VR sensor and the wheel, if you can manage. You might need to make your bracket a bit stronger too - it's a common cause of mis-firing around 3500 - 4000 rpm, as the bracket starts to resonate with the engine vibration.

As for your current problem - make sure that you've got the plug leads correctly (in the correct firing order, and that the 3 wires into the coil are correct). Finally, make sure that the gap in your trigger wheel is exactly in the right place (look at Autosport Labs site for some really good diagrams).

Finally, if everything is in the right place and connected properly, try disconnecting the MJ unit and just try to run with just the EDIS unit. It should give a fixed 10 degrees BTDC, which will give you a decent idle, but will cough when the revs rise over a few thousand rpm. Once it runs well on just the EDIS, plug the MJ back in and work from there.

An afterthought - are you using shielded cable for the sensor? Do you have just one end of the screening earthed? (mustn't earth both ends!). Are your signal wires well away from the HT leads and high-current devices like the alternator? Any of those can cause false signals that mess up the timing.


HTH
David

[Edited on 28/11/08 by David Jenkins]

quote:

---

Originally posted by r1_pete
Sounds like you have a similar problem to one I had with the carbs, are the slides lifting when you open the throttle? if not the carb tops/diaphragm arent sealing properly.

If you have fuel spluttering out of the carbs when not running it will never run properly, check the needle valves in the carbs. Which Facet pump are you using? if its the cylindrical type they're far too much pressure for bike carbs.

---

i may be wrong but the pump should only come on when in the second key position and it will stay on when the engine is starting in position 3

Originally I had a Facet pump and regulator with my CBR600 carbs, but eventually I sold them and got a bike pump - they give greater flow but at a lower pressure.

quote:

---

Originally posted by David Jenkins
Originally I had a Facet pump and regulator with my CBR600 carbs, but eventually I sold them and got a bike pump - they give greater flow but at a lower pressure.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by tomgregory2000
i may be wrong but the pump should only come on when in the second key position and it will stay on when the engine is starting in position 3

---

I think it was a Filter King, made by Malpassi (not sure of the spelling). The trouble with using a regulator is that it has to be adjusted to the very lowest setting, and it's not easy to get the right pressure. There were some suggestions that it would restrict the flow of petrol - but later on I found that the problems I had at the time were due to other causes! It may be that the Facet pump and regulator would have worked OK - but I wanted to get rid of one bit of doubt.

The bike pumps don't need a regulator (usually) - they are set up to drive carbs directly, so they give the right sort of pressure, at the right flow rate, and almost all of them are self-regulating.

I'm with Tom regarding the wiring - the first position is for accessories (radio, etc) so the pump shouldn't be running. The second position is for 'run', so the pump should be on. The third position is 'start', so the pump should stay on.

Buy a bike pump there made to suite the carbs

We had problems running our CBR600 carbs with a Facet fuel pump (the one specifically for carbs). It did the same as yours, overpressurised the carbs and fuel just dribbled out from all over. It ran but badly with backfires

I'd bet that if you change your pump to a bike one as we did, most of your problems will dissappear

Is the fuel going in the carbs at the top ?were the two pipes join if so i think that's the wrong place that's the breather pipes and should be open to air

Looking at your photos i think you have blocked the pipe at the bottom of the carbs were the fuel goes in
Jacko

[Edited on 28/11/08 by jacko]

carbs on manifold

That pipeyou can see on my carbs is the breather pipe
zx9r carbs
Jacko

I thought that too, the fuel inlet is underneath on my bike engine carbs.

jacko, whats the brass looking connectors with the wires coming out for?

Hi The brass things are electric solenoids that work valves to cut the fuel off if you drop the bike
i believe there only fitted on European bikes
Graham

thanks graham
i haven't got those on mine (my zx9r carbs arrived today )

don't think i'm going to drop my car on its side anyway just wondered what they were. would be quite handy though, like for a cut off button or something

It does look awfully like you are supplying fuel to the breather hoses
I'm sure somebody who knows that carb will be able to point you in the right direction!

Thats what i was going to do but you have to put power to them to close the valves so i removed the guts out of them

What modle carbs have you got ie
[ C /B / E mine are E's
Jacko

quote:

---

Originally posted by jacko
What modle carbs have you got ie
[ C /B / E mine are E's
Jacko

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by jacko
Is the fuel going in the carbs at the top ?were the two pipes join if so i think that's the wrong place that's the breather pipes and should be open to air

Looking at your photos i think you have blocked the pipe at the bottom of the carbs were the fuel goes in
Jacko

[Edited on 28/11/08 by jacko]

---

The steering wheel is on the proper side, he is driving an automobile not a BOAT!

That does indeed look very wrong, fuel goes in the bottom and the top pipes are vents so leave open.

Vacumn will be sourced from the car side of the butterflies.

Regards Mark

quote:

---

Originally posted by Canada EH!
The steering wheel is on the proper side, he is driving an automobile not a BOAT!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by blakep82

quote:

---

Originally posted by jacko
What modle carbs have you got ie
[ C /B / E mine are E's
Jacko

---

errrr... haven't a clue. these ones have tps, so good enough for me (i hope, this time lol)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by black.viper

quote:

---

Originally posted by jacko
Is the fuel going in the carbs at the top ?were the two pipes join if so i think that's the wrong place that's the breather pipes and should be open to air

Looking at your photos i think you have blocked the pipe at the bottom of the carbs were the fuel goes in
Jacko

[Edited on 28/11/08 by jacko]

---

Wowwwwww... you mean, that I connect pipe for breathing on fuel line ... and tube for connect fuel line I connect on vacuum sensor on engine...



...and engine was running! Im happy that Im still alive

The "F" tube on your photo is only for fresh air too carbs? And pipe which I connect on vacuum sensor is main input for fuel?

How is possible that engine was running?

Thanks gods that I survived!

---

The pipe you have going to the vacuum sensor as you call it is the sump breather
and a pipe from the breather wants to go to a catch tank but remove the one way valve first
What made you think your pipe would want to go there?

Thank you guys for ideas... next week I have lot of work :-)

IŽll start with new bracket for VR sensor, change fuel pipe for right place and small upper pipes I let it breathing fresh air (no fuel ) and if every thing will be OK and fuel will not splattering I hope that I will not have to change my new Facet fuel pump... but I will see..

Thank you for this forum and for nice people here!!!

Lot of wishes from Czech republic,

Petr