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Author: Subject: Fog switch IVA fail?
Nickp

posted on 12/3/17 at 12:24 PM Reply With Quote
Fog switch IVA fail?

One of my other fails was that the fog light operated with both sides and headlights. Bit of a school boy error but that's how the Premier loom I had seems to be set up so that was how I connected it up. I thought it'd be simple to switch it to the headlights, but it has to work with both main and dip. I was going to use 2 relays energised from either the switched earth from the column switch or the 12v from each relay to feed the original 12v to the switch, unless there's a easier / more obvious solution I'm missing?
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owelly

posted on 12/3/17 at 01:21 PM Reply With Quote
Take the live before the main/dip switch.





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ste

posted on 12/3/17 at 01:21 PM Reply With Quote
do you have the wiring diagram for your loom?
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Nickp

posted on 12/3/17 at 03:34 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by owelly
Take the live before the main/dip switch.


It's switched earth, and separate live feeds to dip/main relays.

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snowy2

posted on 12/3/17 at 04:49 PM Reply With Quote
this has often been covered here.....

this is a link to one of many.....

fitting fog lights





sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.

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Nickp

posted on 13/3/17 at 07:17 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by snowy2
this has often been covered here.....

this is a link to one of many.....

fitting fog lights


Cheers, sounds like pin56 is the answer

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pekwah1

posted on 13/3/17 at 08:41 AM Reply With Quote
have you also got a warning or auto shut off thing wired in for the fogs?
This was a new addition in the IVA manual, and basically means that once you've turned your ignition off while your fogs are still turned on, that the fogs won't come back on again when you start up the car next, or there's an audible alarm to tell you you've left the fogs on.

I didn't have to do this on my first IVA but planning another one soon and saw this was a requirement

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pekwah1

posted on 13/3/17 at 08:43 AM Reply With Quote
Actually, maybe ignore me with my last comment.....
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=208114

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WesBrooks

posted on 17/3/17 at 11:05 AM Reply With Quote
I'm obviously going to have to re-read the manual but I think my proposed set up is compliant.

I'm using the standard ignition barrel from a land rover discovery which has key-in detection. Both front and rear fogs can be switched independently and can be run with just position lights. A buzzer will sound if I pull out the key without turning off the position lights (but is killed by an alarm interlock) and another buzzer will sound if I turn off the position lights with the fogs still switched on. All switches are switch to earth to allow relay coils to be energised.

Dropping to position lights only if fog gets bad with the fog lights still on can sometimes make driving easier as the mains just reflect back off the fog. If the fog is bad enough to require me to drop to position on the front I certainly wouldn't want the rear fog lights switching off. With regards to the independent control of front and rear this is mainly being considerate to other drivers. Fog bad enough to require front fog lights is rare, in borderline cases when there is no traffic behind I'll switch on the rears until someone is following. In this case if it got a little worse and I was at the front of a queue of traffic then I'll have the fronts on, but not the rears.

[Edited on 17/3/17 by WesBrooks]

Edit 2: It's worth noting I am planning for mine to be driven in all weathers and perhaps longer treks, so priorities shift a bit from a typical sports car brief. Doors are also removable too so no courtesy light switch to ground for the doors being open.

[Edited on 17/3/17 by WesBrooks]





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WesBrooks

posted on 17/3/17 at 11:37 AM Reply With Quote
I may have to revisit my plans to make it fit closer to the wording of the guide, so:

(Buzzer sounds)

IF

(rear fog lights switch on) AND {(Ignition Off) OR [(Key withdrawn) AND (drivers door open)]}


...it doesn't actually say anything about the state of the position light switch, but I don't think you could get to the above without the buzzer sounding, so ish compliant. If position lights on and key out buzzer sounds. If fogs on while position lights off buzzer sounds.





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loggyboy

posted on 17/3/17 at 11:53 AM Reply With Quote
Buzzer isnt necessary for cars that dont have Canbus
-
I had this confirmed by VOSA - See the link a few posts above.

[Edited on 17-3-17 by loggyboy]






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WesBrooks

posted on 17/3/17 at 12:19 PM Reply With Quote
Do you mean your other post with this in:

quote:

I can confirm that the requirements for the rear fog lamp are still that they only operate when dipped beam, main beam or front fog lamps are lit.
The requirements of note 4 will therefore only apply if the rear fog lamp then operates if the position lamps are switched off and back on, as is possible on some modern CAN bus wiring systems. As most kit cars take the
fog lamp feed directly from the headlamp circuit, this will not be possible and as such there is no requirement for the systems listed in note 4 to be fitted.




I'm currently not taking my logic feed for the fogs from the head lamp switch. I'm taking it from the position light switch. Therefore I need a buzzer?

Section 28 Rear Fog lights. Required standard 4 suggests you can only have rear fog lights lit when main, dipped, or front fog lights are on. Comply with that then it is easy and your through. If you want to have the rear fogs on with only position lights, the you need to look at notes 3 and 4. Note 4 gives the option of the mustn't come on again after turning the lights on and off (be it through turning the car on and off or the position lights on and off) or using a combination of buzzer and tell tail.

I'm going to have a re think to see if taking the logic feed from the headlamps or front fogs would suit my requirements. I currently can't see a situation where you would need position only on the front, fogs on the rear and no front fogs. I just like to keep the logic a little simpler than that for reliability! If a buzzer breaks it's no problem but wiring for no buzzer leaves the rear fogs reliant on an extra switch.

Edit: Front fogs or headlights would work fine, but I can't get my head around how to wire that with switch to earth switches controlling the coil side of a relay without using diodes which so far I've avoided other than internal ones in relays to dump the inductive kick back. More thinking required, but I will revisit when the buzzer sounds. Thanks for the input & suggestions.

Edit 2: Good job I looked! Buzzers wouldn't have worked as required. Had a choice of change to double pole switches or use diodes. I've added the diodes and ditched the buzzer.

[Edited on 17/3/17 by WesBrooks]





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