spunky
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| posted on 14/6/06 at 02:28 PM |
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wet sumps, dry sumps....
I sure this has been covered in great detail before, but worth a revisit.
A bike leans as it corners, therefore little surge problems during cornering.
A bike accelerates damn hard, so any surge will occur during this and breaking.
Now then;
Oil surge problems occur in a bec during hard cornering mainly. However, whilst in the bike the engine across the frame but in a bec it is (usually)
longitudinal so the cornering/accelerating forces are switched.
How is it that a bike can propel itself through to 100mph in 6ish secs or stand up on the back wheel for 100yards without any oil starvation problems
and yet in a bec dry sumping or accusump is called for.
I'm not disputing the need just curious as to the reasons behind it.
Discuss
John
The reckless man may not live as long......
But the cautious man does not live at all.....
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Bob C
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| posted on 14/6/06 at 02:50 PM |
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I tend to agree -however, by common consent:
Blackbird engines die quickly in a BEC (no. 3 main brg or something)
Busa engines are a lot of money to take a chance on.....
Bob
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Hellfire
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| posted on 14/6/06 at 04:11 PM |
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That is basically our reasoning on the decision not to install a dry sump on the ZX12R. However, when you start to move away from being stock and
introduce performance enhancing modifications, along with slick tyres (on a motorbike), you may find you do get oil starvation problems on
acceleration.
Like you, I'm not saying that the reasons for dry sumping aren't justified but I think a lot of it is self-perpetuating and the risks of
oil starvation appears to be greater than what it actually is. By dry sumping, you are giving your engine maximum protection and therefore
safeguarding your investment regardless of whether it really needs it or not.
We cannot justify the cost of a dry sump (as yet)  ) which is why we have a shortened and baffled sump. If we still find we are having oil surge
problems we will explore other avenues without resorting to accusumps or dry sumps. I guess only time will tell for sure.
Phil
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marc n
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| posted on 14/6/06 at 04:55 PM |
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in our grp n saloon cars we where not alowed to run a dry sump system, and we had huge problem with oil starvation, we where however allowed to modify
the sump, in this case we fitted a box around the pickup pipe with some one way flaps ( similar to those used in fuel cells these allowed the oil into
the pickup area but not out ) never blew another engine ,
have also heard of people using special foam to baffle the area ( think this is what holeshot do )
i know jack runs many busas and zx12s with no dry sumps and i dont think he has any problems
ref the blackbid a mate used to grasstrack a car with a bird very sucessfully but it did run the crank bearings twice a year due to starvation
if you have the spare cash then a dry sump is the way to go to be on the safe side, but in some cases this may not be feasable as the stage 3 dry
sump kits especially on the zx12s protrude the original bike engine by some margin requiring alteration to the passenger bulkhead, will try and find a
pick to show what we do to accomodate them
best regards
marc
[Edited on 14/6/06 by marc n]
please email rather than u2u
direct workshop email ( manned 8am till 6pm )
www.mnrltd.co.uk enquireys to :-
chrismnrltd@btinternet.com
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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marc n
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| posted on 14/6/06 at 04:57 PM |
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think the flaps that we used came from a vauxhall astra possibly ??? know you can buy them brand new i even picked the up from the dealership in ripon
but cant remember which one could be alfa, vauxhall, or fiat
please email rather than u2u
direct workshop email ( manned 8am till 6pm )
www.mnrltd.co.uk enquireys to :-
chrismnrltd@btinternet.com
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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G.Man
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| posted on 14/6/06 at 05:25 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by marc n
but in some cases this may not be feasable as the stage 3 dry sump kits especially on the zx12s protrude the original bike engine by some margin
requiring alteration to the passenger bulkhead, will try and find a pick to show what we do to accomodate them
best regards
marc
[Edited on 14/6/06 by marc n]
Hope that helps show it
Opinions are like backsides..
Everyone has one, nobody wants to hear it and only other peoples stink!
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marc n
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| posted on 14/6/06 at 05:30 PM |
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yep thats what i meant
please email rather than u2u
direct workshop email ( manned 8am till 6pm )
www.mnrltd.co.uk enquireys to :-
chrismnrltd@btinternet.com
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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