Ferrino
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 08:57 AM |
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First Engine Start
Almost ready to start engine for the first time (it has probably not been run for 18 months or so). What is the best procedure for getting the oil
pump primed? I was going disconnect the fuel pump, remove the spark plugs and remove the power supply to the coils and then turn her over on the
starter (or leave coils connected and just earth the spark plug leads on the head).
How long should I crank for and what kind of oil pressure am I looking for on the gauge before starting her properly with fuel & sparks?
Thankyou 
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jimgiblett
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 09:09 AM |
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If you have fully drained the engine of oil since it was last run I would recomend that you fill the oil filter with as much oil as possible.
Remove spark plugs and crank away. If you can disconnect the fuel pump it will save flooding it. I cranked mine for approx 30 secs before the oil
pressure light went out. After this recheck the oil level and top up if necessary.
- Jim
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Ferrino
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 09:49 AM |
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Thanks Jim. I have currently filled the engine with oil up to the top of the sight glass ('99 R1) and will adjust to the overfilled level when
it is running. I have not filled the oil filter though - can I remove it and fill it without oil pissing out everwhere?
Also, what oil pressure does your warning light come on at? I don't have a pressure switch which illuminates a light at a preset value, just a
digital display of the current pressure.
Finally, if I pull out the spark plugs, do I just leave them near the cylinder head as I crank away?
Thanks!
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jimgiblett
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 10:11 AM |
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Removing the filter may release some oil but IIRC it is situated above the level of the oil in the sump so you'll probably be okay.
Oil pressure light is set quite low for something like 8 psi. When the oil is hot it flickers on at idle.
As for the plugs I would remove them and just let the leads hang.
- Jim
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tks
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 10:12 AM |
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nahhh
how far can you go...!
every start is a dry moment!!
i wouldn´t care, just start and in 1second the oil will be everywhere
aslong as there is enough oil in!
Tks
The above comments are always meant to be from the above persons perspective.
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jimgiblett
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 10:44 AM |
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Not every start is a dry moment. The filter and the pump will normally remained partially primed with oil. The purpose of these activities is to get
oil pressure quicker. Once primed oil pressure will come very quickly.
- Jim
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bernie955
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 10:54 AM |
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Put a squirt of oil in each cylinder as well. The walls will be dry after all that time. Cranking will lubricate cylinder walls. Excess will burn off.
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G.Man
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 11:43 AM |
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A small squirt of duck oil down the plug holes is sufficient for lubing the barrels, thicker oil just gets scraped away by the rings...
spin it over without the plugs and it will be fine once the oil light is out for 10 seconds...
Opinions are like backsides..
Everyone has one, nobody wants to hear it and only other peoples stink!
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David Jenkins
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 11:57 AM |
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Just don't spin it over without plugs for very long if you've just fitted a brand-new camshaft (it's one of the things they tell you
explicitly NOT to do - they say that there's rarely enough oil to lube the cam properly.)
David
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andyharding
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 12:25 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by bernie955
Put a squirt of oil in each cylinder as well. The walls will be dry after all that time. Cranking will lubricate cylinder walls. Excess will burn off.
Only do this on an engine with fully run in rings. When running in new rings the bores should not be lubricated to ensure that they quickly wear a
good seal with the rings.
Are you a Mac user or a retard?
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Ferrino
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 01:25 PM |
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Thanks guys - I will fill up the oil filter (I think you are right and it's just above the oil level) and put a small squirt of oil down the
plug holes. As I don't have a pressure switch, I will just look for a sensible pressure reading on the digidash.
One other thing - is 30 seconds of cranking likely to knacker my small bike battery? I have my old car battery, would that be better to use?
[Edited on 31/5/06 by Ferrino]
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NS Dev
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 02:38 PM |
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I have never gone for the cranking on the starter idea at all myself.
The engine will actually go without oil for more turns than it will if it fires up, and oil pressure fit to put the light out will still not do much
for the engine anyway (that's why I use a 35psi light)
Just fire it up as normal with a dash of oil in each bore (unless new rings have been fitted) and don't rev it until you have oil pressure (5
secs usually)
then, especially if you have a new cam fitted, follow the cam run-in procedure.
Retro RWD is the way forward...........automotive fabrication, car restoration, sheetmetal work, engine conversion
retro car restoration and tuning
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JoaoCaldeira
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 09:29 PM |
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Best answer I've ever seen, from Brian @ Psycraft
It sounds like you have looked after it. What we always do with engines that
have been stored for a while is to go and buy some cheap bog standard engine
oil. I'm assuming it was drained of oil before storage, if not do that first
and fit a new filter. Take off the rocker cover and pour a couple of litres
of oil down over the cams and then fill the motor to normal level through
the normal filler and refit the rocker covers. Whip out the plugs,
disconnect the fuel pump cables and spin the motor over on the starter for
30 seconds or so and do this five or six times before refitting the plugs.
Reconnect the fuel pump and gas up the tank, turn on the ignition and make
sure the fuel pump fires up, it should stop after a few seconds. Most common
reasons if it doesn't are the tip-over switch or the kill switch / clutch
switch / neutral switch combination that stops the bike rider from starting
it in gear with the clutch out etc and ending up as a pile on the floor.
Chech around the fuel pipes, injectors and fuel rails for any signs of
leakage. If there is no coolant already in the motor then fill it with
distilled water (save the coolant for now) and leave the radiator cap off.
Short out the radiator fan switch just to make sure it is working and as a
cross check in case the temp gauge does not show when it is getting too hot,
then reconnect it to the switch.
Now, grab an extinguisher (I know you won't need it but better safe and all
that) and preferably have someone else there before you try to fire it up.
Once running just let it idle and blip the throttle to let it rev to 4-5K a
few times. Let it warm up slowly while keeping a constant eye out for fuel /
coolant / oil leaks. Do not run it for more than 4 or five mins. Shut it
down and let the oil drain down into the sump, take a look through the sight
glass and check for condensation (a little is quite normal) Drain off some
of it into a CLEAN container so you can take a good look at it, a little
black is no problem but any sign of white and you need to start to worry.
Next drain the water and refil with coolant, top up the oil and restart (no
rad cap still). Let it run for five mins with occaisional blips to throttle,
this should help to bleed any air in the cooling system. Shut it down, and
fit the rad cap. If you have a source of ultra violet light it will be
usefull as the coolant shows up really easy under black light and is the
best way to check for coolant leaks. Now its time ot get the motor upto
proper temperature so start it again and let it run as before but for longer
this time. If you have a temp gauge you just need to keep an eye on it but
DO NOT TRUST IT. Just let it get upto temperature in its own time (it will
take a little while). If all looks good leave it running to get it hot (you
can give it a few revs now if your confidence is getting better). If the
temp gets upto red or the fans start to run then that is hot enough. Shut it
off and let it cool down.
Drain the oil into a CLEAN container while the engine is still good and
warm, if if looks clean then just refill with some semi-synth quality bike
oil (do not be tempted to use high perfomance car oils) if it is dirty then
you should change the filter again, if it is white / milky then go and have
a cry in your tea...
Take the rad cap off once it is cool and take a good sniff, can you smell
petrol / exhaust fumes? If you look into the coolant is there a oil film on
the top? These are typically signs of leaky head gaskets.
Good luck, and let us know how it goes
Cheers
Brian
www.psycraft.co.uk
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 31/5/06 at 09:45 PM |
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Eh, what happened there, firstly a duplicate post, then when I delete the duplicate, the original isnt there!
Anyway, retyping roughly what I said....
quote:
Originally posted by NS Dev
I have never gone for the cranking on the starter idea at all myself.
The engine will actually go without oil for more turns than it will if it fires up, and oil pressure fit to put the light out will still not do much
for the engine anyway
Its true it will turn over more times if doing it this way, but the important difference is if spinning it over without the plugs in, there's no
significant forces on the big-end/main bearings.
If you spin it over first you're not really looking for oil pressure as such, you just use the oil pressure as a signal that oil has passed
through the pump and into the galleries, so when you fire it up properly, you know there will be pressure to the bearings straight away, the same as
if starting the engine normally (ie not after a long standing period).
If you don't do this, the galleries and pump are dry so the mains / big-ends will run under load for several seconds before they get
meaningful oil pressure, even at idle the forces exerted on the bearings may well be significant if there's no oil film or oil pressure to
protect them.
cheers
Chris
[Edited on 31/5/06 by ChrisGamlin]
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G.Man
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| posted on 1/6/06 at 04:48 AM |
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Exactly Chris..
With a new cam, it should have been assembled with cam lube anyway, and its no worse than spinning it with the plugs for the camshaft... at least
without the plugs it wont strain the big ends and mains excessively..
It takes the same number of revolutions to get oil to the relevant bearings with or without plugs, and once the oil pressure is up, all the parts wil
be floating in oil like they should be...
Most stress is put on the bearings when the engine starts without oil pressure...
Opinions are like backsides..
Everyone has one, nobody wants to hear it and only other peoples stink!
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