Mave
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| posted on 29/12/05 at 05:15 PM |
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Dreaming about new project: mid-engined
The build of my Indy is currently in a state that I have to tie together loose ends, and wait for the painter to finish my bodywork, before I can
finish the car. Not the most satisfying part of the build for me, so I've already started thinking about a new project.
This time I want something mid-engined with a bit more comfort. Looking at what's available in the market today in this category, is somewhat
disappointing. There's the GTM Libra and Spyder: I love the styling, but a bit pricey, and how come the door never seems to close properly at
the bottom?
The Marlin 5Exi; styling is ok (looks remarkebly similar to the Strathcarron!), but that soft-top really puts me off.
Sylva Mojo and R1ot: I love them under the skin, but the skins are too "basic".
Then there's a whole range of LMP style cars. Some of them are really nice, but LMP is too "hard-core" for my intended use.
To cut a long story short: with my Indy I made the bodywork myself, and now I'm thinking of doing it the other way around; design and fabricate
the chassis myself, and buy some body work. For the bodywork I'm considering the body of the Smart Roadster Coupe, with a GRP copy of the metal
center section. And with something like 200 bhp in the back, instead of the 100 bhp lump the Brabus version has. Of course my "Roadster"
would have a spaceframe chassis, and the Smart's bodywork is mostly plastic, so the weight will be very low.
Does this sound like a stupid idea? (of course not everybody likes the styling of the Smart Roadster Coupe, but I like it a lot!)
Marcel
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MikeR
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| posted on 29/12/05 at 05:37 PM |
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personally i think they're really cool. I'd love one - even with 100bhp.
200bhp scares the willy's out of me 
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Simon
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| posted on 29/12/05 at 05:38 PM |
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My only critisiscm would be that for all your effort you would end up with something that looked like a (notso)Smart.
Maybe use that for the bodywork plug, but restyle so it ain't a smart.
ATB
Simon
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MikeR
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| posted on 29/12/05 at 05:47 PM |
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daft question, where would you get the bodywork from & how much?
remember a story about someone who hired a lambo for a weekend, drove it to some place and spent all weekend using it as a plug for a GRP mould.
no idea how true it is or what state the car was returned in.
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Mave
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| posted on 29/12/05 at 06:40 PM |
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I agree with the "you end up with a Smart" bit. But as I like its styling, compared to most kits, that's not a bad thing. In a way
it is nice to have something that doesn't scream "I'm special". Untill you press the loud pedal that is.
Where to get the bodywork; I have no clue as to what it will cost when bought new from Smart. I seem to remember that the price of the bodywork for
the original Smart wasn't too expensive, a couple of years ago (something like a 1000 pounds for all of it?!? Well, all of it is just two doors,
bonnet and tailgate or so). But I'm more counting on parts to come up on ebay, just like Elise body parts.
Anyway, I won't be making another body from scratch. Been there, done that (eventhough it was only for a Seven; it is a lot of work! Loads of
respect for Steve and Alan for their efforts)
Marcel
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theconrodkid
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| posted on 29/12/05 at 07:22 PM |
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ive been planning a similar thing,more LM stylie with a bike engine.
did go into elise body on my own chassis but damaged/2nd hand panels for those cost a fortune.
the smart body idea seems good,sexy looking car,get a set of panels and make a mould from them,as long as you make a few differences mercs cant sue
you....i.d have a set of you
who cares who wins
pass the pork pies
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SixedUp
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| posted on 29/12/05 at 07:33 PM |
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Personally I dont really like the look of any of the Smarts, but it will make a mental "Q" car. They wont see which way you go 
Got to be worth doing for that alone
Cheers
Richard
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mark chandler
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| posted on 29/12/05 at 08:14 PM |
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"remember a story about someone who hired a lambo for a weekend, drove it to some place and spent all weekend using it as a plug for a GRP
mould"
I know someone that did that for a lotus excel years ago, worked a treat. He had spun his one and stoved in the rear, it was a very cheap proposition
when it came to repairs !
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andygtt
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| posted on 30/12/05 at 11:08 AM |
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Have you considered the AEON.
Razman is building a 2 seater version which is looking very impressive.
Andy
please redefine your limits.
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cornishrob
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| posted on 30/12/05 at 11:13 AM |
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have you considered the shelsley? or aeon? mid engined and not too pricey.
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Mave
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| posted on 30/12/05 at 09:45 PM |
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I don't like the bodywork of the closed Aeon. The open version is o.k., but does have too many flat sections, where I would expect a bit more
shape (like on top of the front wheels), which somehow make it look too "simple", (I know it's a brilliant handling car). Razman is
changing those sections on his car, but that's a lot of work.
The Shelsey; hmm, hadn't thought of that one. Not sure about the styling yet. It's not bad, but its not strong enough in its lines or
something.
Yeah, I know, I'm pickey.
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cornishrob
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| posted on 1/1/06 at 11:42 AM |
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well ill hopefully be spending my cash on a shelsley before the end of the month, sold my beloved GT4 to fund it. I agree the looks of the shelsley
are a bit left to be desired but a roof and comfortable interior and performance to shatter porsches more than makes up for it.
The aeon as you say is a very ugly car, From the front it looks ultima but from the back it looks like they lost interest and drew the lines straight
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akumabito
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| posted on 1/1/06 at 12:49 PM |
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I believe bodypanels for the Smart are very expensive.. besides that, I have heard Mercedes has a very active "gestapo-department", suing
people left and right for making major alterations to their vehicles..
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cornishrob
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| posted on 1/1/06 at 08:08 PM |
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surely you dont sign a contract when you buy a mercedes saying I will not be modifying this car?
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MikeR
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| posted on 2/1/06 at 10:20 AM |
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i think if you bought the car and then modified the panels you'd be ok. I suspect its people buying panels or copying them that is the
problem.
love to see the court writ if it was a case of "i've modified my own car".
(and i have to admit in some cases i'd hope the manufacturer would win with the cars i've seen some chav's driving - except that
goes against my principle of let people live!)
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andygtt
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| posted on 2/1/06 at 11:16 AM |
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copying them for your own use will be no problem.... it will be people selling them that will get court action.
Andy
please redefine your limits.
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Mave
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| posted on 2/1/06 at 04:40 PM |
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Yep, I think Andygtt is right with that statement.
It's quite nice to think about this project, and dream about the specs... Audi 1.8T engine (225 bhp), or perhaps Honda Civic Type-R (200 bhp).
Hmmm......nice. Such a shame that I have to finish my Indy first, and then find the space (and funds) to start on the next project!
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andygtt
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| posted on 2/1/06 at 11:10 PM |
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I still need to start my indy........
Andy
please redefine your limits.
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RazMan
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| posted on 5/1/06 at 09:51 PM |
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Cornishrob & Mave,
I know that I am biased but you might want to reconsider the Aeon as it has now been redesigned. To be more accurate, I have reprofiled the front
section and the result has been adopted by Aeon as the next stage in its development. I have also revamped the rear section but that is just for me at
the moment.
As you can see it is quite different from the original design - the flat front profile is more rounded with different light units. This is not the
finished product either - just one of the trials before the real thing which is much, much better (and a bit hush hush until the actual launch )
The rear section has Lexus style lights moved above the bumper and a rear window which opens!
More still to come in the pipeline so don't write it off just yet 
[Edited on 5-1-06 by RazMan]
Cheers,
Raz
When thinking outside the box doesn't work any more, it's time to build a new box
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andygtt
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| posted on 5/1/06 at 09:59 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by RazMan
I know that I am biased but you might want to reconsider the Aeon as it has now been redesigned.
[Edited on 5-1-06 by RazMan]
I'm not biased and I recon that fronts gona look better than my Ultima did.... good work Mike.
Fancy coming round and doing my body?
Andy
please redefine your limits.
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Mave
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| posted on 6/1/06 at 04:44 PM |
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Razman; very well done indeed. However, I still don't like the shape of the "cockpit" (from the front). Maybe the roof is just too
flat or something. Or the sides are to flat. I dunno.
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RazMan
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| posted on 6/1/06 at 05:03 PM |
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Fair comment Mave, but as I said before this is not the finished design yet. The doors are being revamped as we speak (I'm covered in fibreglass
dust ) and have a slight convex shape for rigidity along with an inner skin which makes them much more substantial. I hate flimsy kit car doors and
wanted to make them look more 'production' like.
One of the big advantages with this type of car is that you can easily change any aspect as far as your expertise, budget or imagination allows
Cheers,
Raz
When thinking outside the box doesn't work any more, it's time to build a new box
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cornishrob
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| posted on 6/1/06 at 06:44 PM |
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that looks better, still not sure on the splitter on the front, i think it needs to be incorporated into the front tbh but thats the way i would like
to see it.
have you changed the sides at all to include vents? this was something i think the aeon lacked, the ultima has them as a feature as do most mid
engined cars have some form of ventilation in the quarters and i think the aeon would have a lot more character should it have them
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RazMan
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| posted on 6/1/06 at 07:16 PM |
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Side vents could easily be incorporated but as the radiator is in the front there is no real need unless intercoolers are needed for a twin turbo
setup
In my own rear section I have installed a couple of NACA ducts behind the rear window for getting cold air to the air filter.
I was originally I was going to put these on the rear wings but my twin fillers (my tanks are in the sills) took that spot. Here's another
'work in progress' pic. I really must take some up to date ones!
[Edited on 6-1-06 by RazMan]
[Edited on 6-1-06 by RazMan]
Cheers,
Raz
When thinking outside the box doesn't work any more, it's time to build a new box
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kb58
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| posted on 6/1/06 at 07:24 PM |
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Eh... those NACA ducts do nothing since there is no rearward laminar airflow to feed them. Far better would be to move them to the sides of the car,
both for asthetics and function. Where they are now will be pointed at and "discussed".
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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