Just read this on the mig-welding forum and thought it was worth spreading the word as i'm sure you'll agree. Not sure who the guy is as it
was from another forum before mig-welding, perhaps it should be passed to other forums that people on here are on?
"Yep, I thought I was a goner this time. How simple it was to get into trouble.
After seeing and reading so many warning labels, we tend to no longer pay them any heed. We buy chemicals and sprays at a local parts house and think
"How can this be so bad, health-wise, if I'm buying it over the counter?" Here’s how a small whiff of smoke almost dropped me where I
stood.
I had a rush job to do, welding four diesel tanks. I had to patch where they were pitted by road salt corrosion.
Normally I spray a little carb cleaner on the spot I'm going to weld, wipe it off, then preheat the area with an acetylene torch to get rid of
any solvents. Where I normally get carb cleaner was sold out, so I got a can of brake cleaner and went through my regular routine. To be on the safe
side, I even had the shop door open and the exhaust fan on.
I started TIG welding on Thursday afternoon and had no problem at first. But when I started welding across a really pitted area, I found a couple of
drops of brake cleaner that were lurking in a deep dimple. As I came close to the cleaner, a small puff of white smoke popped up, and I almost passed
out. I made it outside and sat for a while in the fresh air.
After about 10 minutes, I went to the office and sat at the computer to check the warnings on the brake cleaner can I used. That's when my whole
left side started shaking for about 10 to 15 minutes. (I found out later I was having a seizure).
When I was able to control myself again, I read the can's warning: "Vapours may decompose to harmful or fatal corrosive gases such as
hydrogen chloride and possibly phosgene." After reading about hydrogen chloride, I started researching phosgene. The active chemical in brake
cleaner is tetrachloroethylene. When this chemical is exposed to excessive heat and the gas argon, which is used in MIG and TIG welding, it produces
phosgene. Phosgene gas can be fatal with a dose as little as four parts per million: basically a single small puff of smoke. Symptoms can be delayed
from six to 48 hours after exposure. There is no antidote to phosgene poisoning. If you do survive, the long-term effects can be chronic bronchitis
and emphysema.
My breathing still was hard a few hours later, but I felt a little better, so I didn't go to hospital. The chlorine taste and smell in my nose
and mouth were still strong. About midnight, I started coughing and my chest started hurting but I thought this would pass after a night's sleep.
The next day (Friday), the symptoms got worse and my kidneys started hurting, so I drank a bunch of liquids and cranberry juice. For the next four
days, I was constipated and only urinated a lot of clear fluid with no smell. Though sometimes I felt okay, I was really in a lot of pain on and off
for the next several days, as well as weak and tired. Then my urine became very dark and smelt terrible.
By the next Monday, nine days after the poisoning, I lost all balance. I was confused and could hardly talk, so I finally went to the emergency room.
My symptoms were low O2 level, sugar levels out of control, vertigo and I was hurting badly in my entire chest. I was admitted and put into ICU. My
kidneys had probably shut down for those first four days. My lungs were damaged so I had to be on O2. I had to be on insulin to keep my sugar in
check. Since there is no antidote for phosgene, all I could do was try to rest and hope I got better. After CT, MRI, EKG and EEG tests, as well as
several blood tests it looked like, at least for now, there is no permanent damage. However, the MRI showed fluid in my sinuses and a build-up of
fluids near my brain. The phosgene scarred my sinuses, which then became infected. The three doctors I saw said I was really lucky to make it.
After four weeks, it appears that I may have emphysema and chronic bronchitis. I'm on nasal medicine and an inhaler. My sinuses are severely
scarred, and my smell nerves are damaged. I still have that awful chlorine taste and smell. I may also have pancreas damage, so I'm now on some
stronger medicines.
So why am I telling you all this? I hope to save someone from an easily avoidable sever illness or even death. The cleaning sprays commonly found in
thousands of bike shops across the country can be just as dangerous if improperly used. Read the labels and warnings! Look up the chemicals you use.
Just because you got away with it before, doesn't mean you won't get in trouble next time."
worth a repost but was posted last week.
but I've been wondeinrg is it true though? as few drops of carb ceaner anough to knock someone out?
Just another warning, as in electrolysis derusting, welding causes hydrogen embrittlement so don't do it!
quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
worth a repost but was posted last week.
but I've been wondeinrg is it true though? as few drops of carb ceaner anough to knock someone out?
I think that threads like this need to be sticky'ed AND possibly in a section called WARNINGS.
The one that I came across is using twin pack floor paint on floors that were cleaned with proprietry alkaline floor cleaners.
This gives off MUSTARD gas ( espscially when inhaled through a cigarette.
The depot that I worked in was shut down for a couple of days and employees were all given health checks. Except for me I was off on the day the
nurses visited.
Nasty stuff Phosgene, one of the first gasses used in WW1.
Ask any old Fridge engineer who used to use R12, R22, R502, R11 etc when passed through a flame these gasses used to turn to Phosgene.
So if the carcinogenic (cancer causing) properties of the gas didnt kill you the cumulative (have a bad gassing and you may be OK, 2 years later have
another and you'd drop dead because it stays in your blood stream ) same as 2 pack paint, of Phosgene would.
You can never be too carefull about you health, when your young and daft you take risks but when your older those risks might bite you in the ass.
Here endeth the sermon.
Cheers.
Bob 
[Edited on 5/9/09 by splitrivet]
Thought it might be a re-post but i hadn't seen it on here and as you say is always worth a re-post just incase people ( like me ) missed it!
quote:
Originally posted by jollygreengiant
I think that threads like this need to be sticky'ed AND possibly in a section called WARNINGS.
Bobs damn right about your age and how much care you take about your health. Im just turning 30 and regretting all the times i never wore ear
defenders/knee pads or dust masks. Feel like an old man!
When I was at sea I sent the stewards boy to clean toilets, despite his H&S training and warning labels he mix toilet cleaners together and result emergency hospital treatment for breathing disorder. Therefore always read the label and do what it says, even simple chemical produts can be dangerous when mixed.
I missed this 1st time round, so thanks for repost.
Scary stuff! 
Another warning
I just had a question from my 3 year old girl.
Who's that walking? (Mr splitrivet)
I'm going to be more carefull whats on my screen from now on.
quote:
Originally posted by rf900rush
Another warning
I just had a question from my 3 year old girl.
Who's that walking? (Mr splitrivet)
I'm going to be more carefull whats on my screen from now on.
quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
worth a repost but was posted last week.
but I've been wondeinrg is it true though? as few drops of carb ceaner anough to knock someone out?
What's really stupid is that this guy was having all kinds of shaking and seizures, impairement of brain and organ functions, had read up
on exactly what he'd done to himself and how messed up he could be, and still waited 9 days before going to see a doctor!
quote:
Originally posted by Liam
What's really stupid is that this guy was having all kinds of shaking and seizures, impairement of brain and organ functions, had read up on exactly what he'd done to himself and how messed up he could be, and still waited 9 days before going to see a doctor!