I am not a racist, I don't care what colour of skin, religion, sexual orientation anyone is but I am getting more and more annoyed at the hypocracy and stupidity of the country I live in.

To take the most recent event, a school might have to change its name from St. Mary etc to attract more ethnic people. how ridiculous is this! It's a C of E church for crying out loud!
News article here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/3985985.stm

Then there's the good old baa baa ethnic sheep problem, this is an old news article, but I've heard of the problem more locally and recently and it still exists: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/600470.stm

Then there's the issues relating to the police force, far more than I dare to go into, needless to say you can't get into the met unless you're black(sorry, from an ethnic minority) at the moment. This is an old article again, but is still a curreny problem (I have relatives who have applied to many forces and the only one he could get an application form for being a white boy is Kent.): http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2346717.stm

Lastly, an item that rings close to home, where I work, on the bottom of nearly every job advert (there are a lot here, very frequently as it is a big univeristy) they have the line:
We particularly welcome applicants from an ethnic minority as they are under-represented within [organisation] at this level

I have no problem with ethnic people working in any area, but surely it's up to them if they want to work for the police or apply for a job at a university, why are we making such a fuss of promoting the fact that is ultimately affecting other uk nationals/natives getting a job?

I'm sure I've opened a can of worms...

Ned.

[Edited on 8/11/04 by ned]

Hi Ned
As a citizen of fairly advancing years (recently achieved the grand old age of 68) I too share your views on all the points mentioned. It's no wonder people are deserting this country in droves. I get so frustrated at all this PC bull s**t. You know what I mean, safety glasses when playing conkers, where will it end?
Rant over.
Pete(Oldgit)

Of course everyone is entitled to thier point of view, however I cant help but think none of those 'positive discrimination' actions would have been necessary if institutions such as the Metropoliton Police were more diverse in the first place.

IMHO the seperation of religion and education is a VERY good thing. You wanna try growing up in N. Ireland if you think otherwise!

The fair employment agency has been active in NI for decades as it was common practise for folks to get jobs based on who they knew, and often thier religion, rather than their skills. I can't comment for everyone but I'm glad of it's work.

As I said though, everyone is entitled to their opinion.

The problem seems to me, that the minorities involved in each of these issues are far more vocal than the mojority and hence get their way.

Someone said to me last week that they believe that eventually there will be a civil war in this country over these issues, because the majority will stay silent for so long and then burst.

Before we allow this to happen we ought to encourage and support those who support democracy and who will allow us a voice.

The problem here is that you run the risk of being misrepresented and allied to the Nationalists like th BNP. In todays media it would be difficult to get across your message without it being misrepresented.

I would love to stand up and speak my mind, i'm not in the least racist, sexist, ageist or whatever, but i know i wouldn't be allowed to put my full point of view across. I fully believe that my point of view is supported by the majority of people in the country, we only want whats fair and sensible.

Its time as a mass of people with this view to be prepared to speak out and support anyone brave enough to put the point to the country in a sensible and non biased way. What we wnat is a true democrat and not a modern power made corrupt and perverted politician.

Darren

i realised that NI was pretty screwed when those little school girls had to run a gauntlet just to walk to their school.

No one has mentioned asylum seekers. Why is it that they have to cross from Iraq all the way to the uk thro several euro counties before they find a safe place- ie here.

The clue was my visit to Thailand with work in the summer. I saw people sleeping on the streets, couples under bridges, an old lady with 3 4 year old kids sleeping on the pavement. depressing stuff. I said to the Thai I was with that you dont see that in the UK. He said that it was because they were homeless illegal immgrants. I said that doesnt happen in the UK. He asked why. I said it was because the state gives them free money and a place to live.

Now, I dont want to see people on the streets, but there has to be somethign wrong here.

And as Darren says, this just comes over as racist. However, I had to move 80 miles north of my family in london when I got married so I could get somewhere to live.

If I was an immigrant, or I had made my GF pregnant without marrying her, I would have got a council flat.

This assumedly would now go to an immigrant.....


We are in a war with Iraq? Just imagine if people left germany in WW2 and asked for asylum in the uk. What would we have done? I think it was called a prison.

atb

steve

[Edited on 8/11/04 by stephen_gusterson]

We're not accepting anyone into the Order who isn't thoroughly British. It's not me it's Lodge policy, sorry. I think the PC brigade are getting too far up their own backsides to realise that before they pointed these things out noone else actually gave a sh!t. If you are a criminal do you really care what nationality the policeman is when he arrests you.
Edit. Come to Chesterfield Steve. We have homeless people living on the pavement now because the council put a covered walkway where the warm air vents blow out of the shopping centre. I don't mind that but it's when they hang round the cashpoints drinking tramp fuel (White lightning and Special Brew) all day. Most of them seem to be UK residents, by the way.

Disclaimer:- I don't really subscribe to any racist or elitist organisations and do not condone the actions of anyone who does.

[Edited on 8/11/04 by Peteff]

I agree with almost all that has been posted so far.

I am not in any way rascist, sexist, homophobic etc., but it seems that there is a growing discrimination against the white middle class male who is slowly becoming the most disadvantaged in society as he is the only one not allowed to celibrate who he is.

The police force has a black policemans organisation, there are Womens' groups all over the place, Radio 4 has womans hour.

If I were to start a White policemans organisation that would be branded as racist. If people have male membership only clubs they are villified, and when Radio 4 had an (admittidly crap) program aimed at men - the locker room - feminists everywhere where outraged.

It strikes me though that most of this political correctness isn't brought about by the 'minority' groups themselves but by middle class do-gooders who have to patronise these groups by defending them on thier behalf.

Oh god I've started again!! - Rant over.

Phil

[Edited on 8/11/04 by philgregson]

don't forget ethnic (I mean black) music, such as the MOBO (music of black origin) awards. also don't forget bbc asian network.
It seems to be ok for an ethnic man to call himself black, but if a white man (or woman) does then he/she instantly becomes racist!

Ned.

remeber that one season crap program on tv

Man O Man

where a girl walks up to a bunch of guys and pushes the ones she doesnt want backwards into a swimming pool.

Just reverse gendas on that one and see the ballistic outcry!

atb

steve

quote:

---

remeber that one season crap program on tv

---

IIRC the police forces in certain UK cities is by government instruction supposed to represent the community in which it is operating for example in bradford or other areas of high asian population then the police force is supposed to represent a slice of that community. The problem lies in that enough Asian paople are not applying for these positions so they have to outwardly recruit from these sectors alone.

The police force has just been refused the option to positively discriminate by way of advertising in heavily Asian populated areas such as mosque entrances or Asian socialising establishments. They were refused this right by the government, but in the same scentence were told to make sure that the police force is representative of a cross section of the population it interacts with - cant blame the police for that one

Im a firm believer in the best man for the job policy, if you interview 200 people for the police force and you have 50 vacancies, fill it with the 50 BEST people regardless of age, gender or race. It is the crazy government who are setting the standards here and then not allowing them the means to meet those targets.......................................


round and round and round and round..etc.etc...

quote:

---

Originally posted by ned
don't forget ethnic (I mean black) music, such as the MOBO (music of black origin) awards. also don't forget bbc asian network.
It seems to be ok for an ethnic man to call himself black, but if a white man (or woman) does then he/she instantly becomes racist!

Ned.

---

Just exercise your right to protest, like this guy here:

http://newsbox.msn.co.uk/article.aspx?as=article&f=uk_-_olgbtopnews&t=11881&id=353568&d=20041108&do=http://newsbox.msn.co.uk&i =http://newsbox.msn.co.uk/mediaexportlive&ks=0&mc=5&lc=en&ae=windows-1252
cant even critise murder any more in case it upsets someone

A friend of mine works for a feminist organisation and while doing some research discovered that to call someone "asian" is considered unPC and everyone who isn't white should be refered to as black. Silly.

I think positive discrimination makes race a differentiator, and race shouldn't be that. I think anything that differentiates on race (not culture - that's different) is wrong. The more they make an issue of it the more of an issue it becomes until someone who never cared what colour someone was starts questioning themselves and their own actions and starts thinking "that person is black, he is different".

The immigration problem isn't about race. It's about people who may or may not have a right to be here sponging off our state and possibly depriving people who most certainly do have a right to live here similar amenities.
The basic question must be is positive discrimination (of any kind) good?
Are we a soft touch when it comes to immigration?

Culture is almost a different issue to me. Things like the MOBOs aren't really directly about race but more a cultural development and styles that happen to be related and born out of a minority. There a rock awards, folk, jazz, etc festivals, all with a particular cultural base. You get white rappers and r&b singers just like you get black men in rock bands and dwarf (or is that vertically challenged?) wrestling.

I'm much more likely to judge (prejudge?) someone based on what subculture they subscribe to than their racial origin I think. Be it a 23yr old black man in a 50k bmw down Brixton highstreet or a 19yr old spotty white kid wearing a Kappa tracksuit and hanging around the shops looking shifty. Everyone prejudges everyone all the time. Cultural differences are the real barriers.

Dunno what my point is really but I just thought I'd brain spew a little. Discuss.

Kids at my school don't have 'parents' - it's elitist and divisive.

They have 'folks'. Makes me giggle.

Cheers,

Neil.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2004521125,00.html now thats really upset moi

thats scandilous john. i drove through bradford recently, there were 'happy deepawali' signs up everywhere. I didnt find it remotely offensive. These f*&kwits need their heads stoving in. Their actions are actually racist/religionist in my opinion, as mentioned up the thread it is reverse discrimination. a stand need to be made.

next time i see a job advert that specifies anything about minorities or majorities, i will write and complain.

I personally want to live in this country with all its current diversity of cultures and races etc. What concerns me is that in the not to distant future we will be at the stage where we really cannot sensibly support the people who live here.

Now everyone accepts that there is an over population problem here and that the state cannot cope with the current levels of need from the population. So the answer is to close the doors to everyone of whatever race and sex now. Then sort out the problems and go forward.

The only reason why we cannot and the politicians aren't prepared to come out and say this is the fear of being called racist. In my mind its got nothing to do with racism just common sense. There is no point any of these people coming if we cannot support them. Simple as that.

Every other country in Europe turns them away but we will not.

This country needs to act, but, it does require every one who shares this view to make a stand and vote this way. Voting for any of the main parties at the moment will not change this current policy because they are all too scared of the racist angle that the media will portray.

It will require someone clever, who can get the point across in such away as to make it perfectly clear to everyone from every sector of the community, that its not descrimating and that its just plain sensible.

A lot of our current problems can be controlled if we get a grip on the current population. We have too many old people in relation to working tax payers, too many on the social, too many immigrants etc..

If we can stop the growth we can stand a chance of reflecting on the current position and making proper provision for everyone who is here.

Enoch Powell said nothing more than this, yet spent his whole political career branded a racist, and we are living now his nightmare vision from 40 years ago. It simply cannot be allowed to continue, for everyones future benefit.

Was thinking about this yesterday, and what this country could do with is a nice plague to trim the population down to size, would help resolve some of the issues Darren mentions and hopefully sort out the pensions and housing problems for the next few years....

Ned.

quote:

---

Originally posted by ned
what this country could do with is a nice plague to trim the population down to size, would help resolve some of the issues Darren mentions and hopefully sort out the pensions and housing problems for the next few years....

Ned.

---

if we were to have some plague type thing, like a super flu, it would attack the weak of health first. it would lower population, but would be most effective among elderly and those sickly types that are a drain on the nhs.

works two fold, redresses population imbalance and takes the pressure, eventually of the nhs (i apreciate they may be busy for a while till the flu dies down)

tom

We could take a leaf out of Kenny Everetts book and "round them all up, put 'em in a field and bomb the bast*rds"...

Or we could take the other leaf from his book and sleep with HIV infected individuals and thus start removing ourselves from being a drain..........

Enoch Powell was not a racist. He was a nationalist. Some people cannot understand the difference.

Probably the reason why is that racists hide behind the banner of nationalists.

I listened to an obituary of Powell's on Radio 4 after he died with various black and Asian academics defending Powell.

To disagree with multi-culturalism is not racist. Many countries try and help new settlers to assimilate and integrate and I believe the Home Office has instigated some sort of scheme to teach immigrants English and a bit of background to British history and society. The U.S. does this and has done it for a long time. They also have a very strong nationalistic populace and it is not seen as a sign of prejudice.

Anyone who is different to the majority can create resentment, be that on a national level over alien cultures or on a classroom level (Lord of the Flies).

God I can waffle.

Cheers,

Neil.

its kicking off in holland now,tins hats on boys

To the wonderful world of the PC US of A. Sounds like you are starting to acquire the sentiments (as well as the letigiousness) of our society. I too am not racists, however, I do get fed up with PCness, Hiring quotas, benifits to illegal alians (not martians, but hispanics, asian, MIs, etc. ) But then again, around here the hispanics will do the work that the local white farmers won't. We also have alot of what we call white trash, folks that are having babies just to get the added benifits from the government, don't hold a job, live in government housing and make more than I do living on welfare.
I could rant a long time on this subject.
So I guess my rreal point it, seems as if the UK government is embracing the bad habits of our own. I fell for ya.

David.

'make more than I do living on welfare'

that can be read both ways

atb

steve

They make more living on welfare than I do workin' 60 hours a week...

Does that sound better....?


Also, the police are chastised for racial profiling, ie. targeting blacks, since the crime data indicates a majority of inner city offences are committed by blacks, is that profiling?


Now you really got my dander up....

I have to go have a cuppa coffee, black, no cream or sugar, is that racist?