tegwin
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:16 PM |
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Gas fire fittings?
Our coal effect gas fire has been messing us about for a year or so now... we had an engineer in twice and both times he didnt fix it..
So I had a look at the weekend and found a badly pitted pipe that feeds the pilot light... it appears that it leaks when it gets hot so the pilot
light goes out.. the gas instead burns an inch lower where it shouldnt be...This lets the thermocouple get cool which then means the fire goes
out..
The bras collar on the pipe is corroded to the pipe...
I need to replace this entire assembly... none of the local places seem to be able to help..
Anyone know where I can get something like this made up?
It has two very weird ends....
This end goes into the gas control box:
The pilot jet slots over the end of this and is then clamped inplace by doing up the brass collar in its housing... Note the pitting caused by
heat..
Complete assembly looks like this:
Anyone have any ideas where I could get something like that?.... The local places just gave me the "health and safety" cack and didnt
want to help.....
[Edited on 2/2/10 by tegwin]
[Edited on 2/2/10 by tegwin]
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mookaloid
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:23 PM |
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I think they will only supply 'Gas Safe' registered people nowadays.
Maybe get the last guy who looked at the fire and point out that he missed the obvious problem. Perhaps he will come back and fit a replacement for
you with no call out charge as he should have spotted it before.
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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907
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:27 PM |
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I would silver solder the old ends onto a new bit of copper pipe.
Paul G
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blakep82
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:27 PM |
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but he won't be impressed that you've taken it apart, as you know, its illegal 
if you've done it legally and you are gas safe registered, why did you get someone else to do it first time round 
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
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tegwin
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:28 PM |
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Urgh... I really dont want another tradesperson in my house... they cost the earth and not one has ever been any good.... Hence why everything gets
done by me now... I know the jobs been done properly with care and attention that way...
Its silly.. I could go to homebase etc and buy a new gas fire.... so why cant I buy a part for one!!
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tegwin
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:32 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by 907
I would silver solder the old ends onto a new bit of copper pipe.
Paul G
Interesting idea... the pipe isnt copper though.. its some steel or other?
And what temperature does silver solder melt at? The pipe feeding the pilot light must get pretty damn hot!
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UncleFista
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:32 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
but he won't be impressed that you've taken it apart, as you know, its illegal
That's a "well known fact" that happens to be untrue 
It's only illegal to work on gas appliances for gain, if you work on your own or even for someone else as a favour you're doing nothing
wrong.
The wording is a "competent person" can work on gas, the meaning of competant person hasn't been clarified by the powers that be
Although if you were to "fix" someone's cooker only to have the house explode a few hours later would attract a few questions
Tony Bond / UncleFista
Love is like a snowmobile, speeding across the frozen tundra.
Which suddenly flips, pinning you underneath.
At night the ice-weasels come...
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907
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:37 PM |
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660c
Uncle is right I believe.
I fitted my own gas fire but I did get a fitter to do the flow check.
Paul G
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Thinking about it
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:39 PM |
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What make is the fire? We had a similar problem with a Straxgas, not corroded just a problem with the thermocoupler. I ordered the part from the
manufacturer and there was no problem supplying.
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tegwin
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:41 PM |
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907... if silver solder melts at 660C... what temperature will the steel on the fire get to around the pilot light?
I have no idea what make the fire is... someone has obviously made it from parts as a custom fit job for an old coal grate.....
Its a very old fire! lol.. (circa 20-30 years)
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Confused but excited.
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:52 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by UncleFista
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
but he won't be impressed that you've taken it apart, as you know, its illegal
That's a "well known fact" that happens to be untrue
It's only illegal to work on gas appliances for gain, if you work on your own or even for someone else as a favour you're doing nothing
wrong.
The wording is a "competent person" can work on gas, the meaning of competant person hasn't been clarified by the powers that be
Although if you were to "fix" someone's cooker only to have the house explode a few hours later would attract a few questions
True, but you have to be able to prove that you are a competent person, ie; show your qualifications.
They don't have to define 'competant person', you have to prove you are.
[Edited on 2/2/10 by Confused but excited.]
Tell them about the bent treacle edges!
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907
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 10:57 PM |
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I can't say what temp yours gets to but the nozzles on my propane torch are silver soldered.
Spit on your fingers and then grab the pipe.
Measure the scream volume with a db meter and multiply by 4. 
Paul G
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MkIndy7
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| posted on 2/2/10 at 11:39 PM |
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Obviousley a new pipe from the manufacturer or maybe somewhere on the internet if you type the make and model in a search engine, but if not:
Try putting it back together with Gas Paste smeared on the olives or flared ends or GAS PTFE if really desperate (obviousley being careful not to
obstruct then ends of the pipe).
It might be enough to get it to seal as the Gas is a very low pressures.
Thats Disgraceful whoever left that fault.. they obviously take the time to confirmdeny your observations... or even spray the pipe with leak detector
spray!
(which would also be the best way to check if the gas paste or ptfe has worked)
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James
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 12:02 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by 907
Spit on your fingers and then grab the pipe.
Measure the scream volume with a db meter and multiply by 4.
Paul G
rotflmao!
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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Angel Acevedo
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 03:35 AM |
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DELETE POST!!!
tegwin,
I would start by deleting this thread!!
Then, fix as neat and thoroughly as possible.
If you can make brake lines/systems....
So what....
Beware of what you wish.. for it may come true....
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907
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 08:38 AM |
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To be honest Tegwin, if the fire is that old I'd be thinking of a new one.
The spreader grill and coals must be getting a bit crumbly by now and you could be throwing good money after bad.
My own was a major job, converting from a coal fire involved much hammering and banging, bricklaying, plastering etc,
but to replace one gas fire with another is much easier.
Cheers
Paul G
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UncleFista
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 08:45 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Confused but excited.
True, but you have to be able to prove that you are a competent person, ie; show your qualifications.
They don't have to define 'competant person', you have to prove you are.
No you don't
No one has been prosecuted yet, it has yet to be proved in court. it's up to the courts to prove you're NOT competent
Tony Bond / UncleFista
Love is like a snowmobile, speeding across the frozen tundra.
Which suddenly flips, pinning you underneath.
At night the ice-weasels come...
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r1_pete
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 08:50 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by tegwin
Urgh... I really dont want another tradesperson in my house... they cost the earth and not one has ever been any good.... Hence why everything gets
done by me now... I know the jobs been done properly with care and attention that way...
Its silly.. I could go to homebase etc and buy a new gas fire.... so why cant I buy a part for one!!
Tegwin I'm right with you on that one, every tradesperson I've used in the last 15 years has made a complete arse of the job:
French doors fitted, they took the window out knocked bricks out, and had made the wrong wood effect doors!
Condservatory, they started building with the wrong bricks, awe they'll be ok, kicked them off the job and did it myself.
Block paving, sagged all over, took them to court and got my money back.
Just replaced my CH boiler with a combi, did it all myself, works perfect, CO detector a foot above it - nothing!!
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tegwin
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 09:13 AM |
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The rest of the fire is in perfect working order, its just this one piece thats letting it down...
Will have to see if I can get some gas paste from somewhere and give it a go... its not going to risk damange to anything or anyone, so worth a
try.
Any idea where to buy the gas paste? A quick search on screwfix brings up nothing atall...
Failing that we may have to look at alternative solutions..
[Edited on 3/2/10 by tegwin]
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3GEComponents
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 03:58 PM |
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British standards state that you cannot have soldered joints in the area of the fire, there is a set distance but i can't remember what it
is.
What make is the fire? Most manufacturers will be able to supply replacements.
Kind regards
John
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MkIndy7
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 07:40 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by tegwin
Any idea where to buy the gas paste? A quick search on screwfix brings up nothing atall...
Failing that we may have to look at alternative solutions..
[Edited on 3/2/10 by tegwin]
The stuff we use is made by ROCOL, but looking on Plumb Centers website its about £17 a tin!
Here's some for sale on Ebay, so you've an idea of what it looks like:
Ebay: Gas Paste
There may be others you can use like Boss White, or Hawk etc but its best to check on the back its for use on Gas, as some pastes dry out and
crumblle over time, where Gas paste doesn't.
Just found this on B&Q's website for £7.98
Jet Lube V2 Jointing Compound
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tegwin
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 08:27 PM |
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Amazing... will see if I can get some tomorow and give it a try...
Worth a stab for £8...
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Would the last person who leaves the country please switch off the lights and close the door!
www.verticalhorizonsmedia.tv
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JoelP
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| posted on 3/2/10 at 10:26 PM |
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tewgin, if doing gas work yourself its worth getting a u tube to test for leaks. Only about a tenner, and simple to use.
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MkIndy7
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| posted on 5/2/10 at 12:26 AM |
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Hopefully the Pase will have worked but if not it might be possible to get something like this to fit.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Potterton-6-mm-Pilot-tube-kit-Honeywell-fixings-700723_W0QQitemZ360217273664QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Home_Garden_Hearing_Cooling_Ai
r?hash=item53de9f6540
That also looks a good ebay shop for other spares. I hadn't suggested it before because the end that goes into the Piot looks quite unusual..
but something might fit out of the kit, there quite universal, they do them in 4mm pipe aswell.
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907
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| posted on 5/2/10 at 08:50 AM |
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I find it interesting that in the ebay link (^^^) kit they use aluminium pipe.
Ally has the same melting point as silver solder.
Paul G
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