slim Jim
|
| posted on 4/9/05 at 08:28 PM |
|
|
Type 9 HD 'box
I have just bought a part build Luego Velocity and have decided to start 'simple' and stick a 2.0 pinto in it.
I have been offered a type 9 heavy duty gearbox for nowt. I believe these are from the P100 but cannot find much info on the gearbox.
Can anyone tell me what difference there is between the heavy duty and type 9 gearbox please? Also does heavy duty mean heavy weight? and/or does
heavy duty mean they can handle more power?
Any help/advice would be appeciated
|
|
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 4/9/05 at 08:41 PM |
|
|
Not heard of a HD version of the Type 9 myself!
I guess the P100 and Transit may have been fitted with a heavier duty version to cope with pulling extra weight. This may also mean it has different
ratios to a car version - all guess work though!
Cheers
Nick
|
|
|
MikeR
|
| posted on 4/9/05 at 09:14 PM |
|
|
its been covered before but here goes (if i get it wrong, someone correct me)
There are two types of ford type 9,
normal and heavy duty. the difference is the heavy duty has an extra bearing on the front of the box. If you look down the input shaft from the bell
housing you can see a bolt below the input shaft and some extra machining - this is a heavy duty box.
Heavy duty boxes where fitted normally to the V6 engines. I wasn't aware that the p100 had the heavy duty box.
V6 engines also had the long input shaft - this is about 1" longer than the normal box and means you either have to modify the bell housing or
get the input shaft modified to fit it to a normal inline 4 cylinder engine.
P100's had the ford pinto inline 4 with a different cam shaft producing less power but a bit more torque low down.
Ratios are all pretty much the same apart from first gear. The inline 4 cylinder engines has something like 3.65:1. The v6 has 3.35:1 and the P100
something like 3.9:1. (with the lower the number meaning less turns of hte engine per mph and in our cars lower is better.)
So, p100 box. Strong but first gear is pretty useless except in traffic. If its free - go for it - but check the input shaft length and let us all
know for future reference.
(boy i'm bound to have messed some of that up - its too late to be thinking straight)
|
|
|
NS Dev
|
| posted on 5/9/05 at 07:43 AM |
|
|
you have that exactly right Mike.
The v6 'box has much bigger layshaft bearings front and rear.
Never knew the P100 had the HD 'box. if it does, and if 4th gear is 1:1 (no idea if it is) then it would presumably provide a short input shaft
hd 'box..............which is nice!
|
|
|
MikeR
|
| posted on 5/9/05 at 08:47 AM |
|
|
but its first gear is nearly 4:1..... in fact i'll get the ratios now ........
3.91
2.29
1.38
1.0
.82
This is in my 4 cylinder seirra manual so *shouldn't* be the heavy duty box.
The plus side is that if you've got a stonking great engine a number of the westfield people think 2.4 is about right for the first gear ratio
(no idea what diff they run) but with some diff manipulation you could have an interesting set of ratio's.
|
|
|
Mr G
|
| posted on 5/9/05 at 12:40 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MikeR
normal and heavy duty. the difference is the heavy duty has an extra bearing on the front of the box. If you look down the input shaft from the bell
housing you can see a bolt below the input shaft and some extra machining - this is a heavy duty box.
Think you'll find that only applies to the boxes they put in 4x4s's as all the v6 2wd box's i've had hav'nt had the
different bearing (All 2wd bellhousings are flat faced but the alloy 4x4 ones have the recess to except it)
Cheers
G
Normal is getting dressed in clothes that you buy for work and driving through traffic in a
car that you are still paying for - in order to get to the job you need to pay for the clothes
and the car, and the house you leave vacant all day so you can afford to live in it.
|
|
|
NS Dev
|
| posted on 5/9/05 at 12:52 PM |
|
|
that's not right. Some of the cast iron housings had the cutout too. My MK2 granada 2.8i and capri 2.8i both had the bearing boss and cutout in
the iron housing.
|
|
|
Mr G
|
| posted on 5/9/05 at 09:37 PM |
|
|
Just going by what i've actually been through and fitted and nothing turned up with the extra bearing cover,4sp v6 or 5sp v6 rwd. My standard v6
box in my 83 4i that I pulled out was'nt either.
If you talking about 2.8i mk2 granada or capri then your not thinking of the type5 box are you? Thinking about it its more like what mikeR described
to what I was describing on the type 9 4x4 boxes looking at the following picture.
Otherwise i've been unlucky on the box's i've got hold of 
Cheers
G
[Edited on 5/9/05 by Mr G]
Normal is getting dressed in clothes that you buy for work and driving through traffic in a
car that you are still paying for - in order to get to the job you need to pay for the clothes
and the car, and the house you leave vacant all day so you can afford to live in it.
|
|
|
NS Dev
|
| posted on 6/9/05 at 07:15 AM |
|
|
no, that's the 4 speed from the earlier capris etc isn't it.
My 2.8i special (1987 one) had a type 9 in it with the boss on the front of the layshaft and the notch in the bellhousing to clear
it.......................
The granada was a 1982 5 speed manual, which are pretty rare in 2.8i format, but again that was a type 9 as well.
Incidentally both were tired. the capri one was noisy in 4th gear and the granada had no synchro on 2nd (thing the baulk ring was either totally worn
or had split)
Who knows as to what was fitted to what then!!!???
|
|
|
johnjulie
|
| posted on 6/9/05 at 06:26 PM |
|
|
RETRO CARS had a really good article in OCT 2003, written by BGH Geartech.
Cheers John
JFDI
"Just F*****G Do It"
|
|
|
slim Jim
|
| posted on 6/9/05 at 07:47 PM |
|
|
Thanks very much for all of your words of wisdom guys!
I will have to have a chat with my mate and check he really has a HD 'box from a P100 and then see what all you have said really means to me!
|
|
|
Trev Borg
|
| posted on 6/9/05 at 08:09 PM |
|
|
the V6 long input shaft is 35mm longer
Before you judge a man, walk a mile in his shoes.
By that time, who cares.
You're a mile away, and you've got his shoes
|
|
|
MikeR
|
| posted on 6/9/05 at 11:10 PM |
|
|
35mm / about an inch ........ come on i was close. Anyway who said size matters ?
|
|
|
Steve Lovelock
|
| posted on 8/10/05 at 06:43 AM |
|
|
So, if you were planning to use a P100 box and a LSD diff from a 2.9 Sierra how would that work out as far as the ratios go? I'd prefer an
answer that is non engineering ie, cr*p in 1st OK for all other gears please!
|
|
|
MikeR
|
| posted on 8/10/05 at 08:21 AM |
|
|
it will be fantastic at crawling in traffic and ok doing everything else ...........
aka it will be crap in first gear but ok!
(that is a serious answer)
but look at it another way - you've got a heavy duty box that you can upgrade at some point & crap is relative, its a hell of a lot better
than what you've got now (in fact some people with powerful engines start in a first gear that is not a million miles away from your second gear
so apart from trashing your clutch ....... it might not be so bad)
|
|
|
