Simon
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 12:15 AM |
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Dry Sump?
Is there a cheap way of dry sumping a Rover V8 as I really could do with a tad more clearance under the sump.
Really cheapest way is to lose an inch and widen sump. I've found the attached
http://www.drysump.com/price.htm
but it still seems a bit steep. I could fabricate the "sump" quite easily, it's the pump bit I concerned with.
Thanks
ATB
Simon
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froggy
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 12:32 AM |
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simon ive got a brand new sump with the trap doors in and im going to make a copy with an inch off but no wings . its a range rover sump so i should
be able to make up the capacity over the length of it. ishould think il get enough people interested to make a few as i could get a few sets laser cut
out of a single 8x4 2mm steel sheet
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 12:37 AM |
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If you can do the fab work yourself yes there is a cheaper option.
You need too machine a pump housing for oil pump gears, pinto RV8 are both suitable then mount this on the side of the engine with a suitable belt
drive arrangement too act as a scavenge pump.
then you need too fab a shallow sump, and thru this you run a pipe from the original pick thru the new sump too pick up from a dry sump tank. To do
this you normally use a 1/2" male /male nipple that is fixed too the pick up pipe that when the sump is bolted up one end sticks out thru the
side wall of the sump, with a bonded (dowtey seal) either side it it will be oil/leak proof.
If any of that makes sense well done, if not i will draw a sketch and try n post a pic of it.
Well it is late.
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Simon
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 02:33 AM |
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Jon,
I think I get your drift - a pic would be useful
Now it's late
ATB
Simon
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ed_crouch
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 03:15 AM |
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No no no.
NOW ITS LATE!
But then I am in America at the moment!
Ed.
I-iii-iii-iii-ts ME!
Hurrah.
www.wings-and-wheels.net
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mark chandler
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 10:38 AM |
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Simon,
I thought it was the size of the flywheel that limited things on a RV8 as this is the bit that sticks out furthest.
Just an abstract thought, why not use a PAS pump as the scavanger, these can shift loads of fluid and are easy to obtain.
Regards Mark
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 12:13 PM |
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Here is a rough sketch, hope it explains it better than words, its a very simple method and Ive used it on several engines including £4k worth of atmo
cosworth with no problems.
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Simon
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 09:03 PM |
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Jon,
Thanks - get your drift now!! I take it that the gears are used in a homemade casing for the scavenge pump?
Mark,
Sump on mine is lowest point (by about an inch) but you're right, the bellhousing isn't far behind! That'll be fixed with a
hacksaw
Like the idea of a PAS pump - readily available and bracket still on my engine!
Froggy,
I have an old sump that I might abuse - it's quite useful as it gives me an idea how close to crank I will be!
ATB
Simon
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MikeRJ
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| posted on 29/1/06 at 09:23 PM |
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I suggested the use of a PAS pump for this some time back, but didn't have an overwhelmingly positive reposnse! It would be great as all
brackets etc. are already made for you if you can use it in it's original position.
Only downside is that you could only have one outlet on the sump, connecting more than one pipe together with a manifold wouldn't work very well
I suspect.
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 30/1/06 at 05:44 PM |
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Be interesting too know how much oil a pas pump could shift, someone needs too drop a pipe in a barrel and let one ripp.
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JB
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| posted on 30/1/06 at 07:42 PM |
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Scavenge Pump
One factor that is critical for any pump used as a scavenge is its ability to pump air and self prime. I would check this ability before using any
pump.
Also generally the scavenge side pumps twice the amount of the pressure side.
John
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 30/1/06 at 07:49 PM |
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pump speed can be sorted by using different pulley sizes, the pumps i used where pinto gears in a ally machined housing, never had a problem.
Thats why ide like too see what happened if someone dropped the end of a pipe into some fluid and found out how much it shifted without any priming.
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jack trolley
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| posted on 31/1/06 at 07:27 PM |
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How about using an Electric Scavenge Pump?
This one is a modified Shurflo pump.
Northern Tool sell standard pumps for £50-60.
Mocal and Tilton do VERY similar pumps for £200ish.
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eddymcclements
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| posted on 1/2/06 at 03:59 PM |
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I don't think a PAS pump will be suitable - the spec I found for an electric PAS pump is 1.7 gals / minute which equals 7.65 litres / minute.
The Pace Compact C dry sump pump (their smallest) shifts 6 litres / 1000 rpm / minute. Even if you're only driving the pump at 1/2 engine speed
you're looking in the region of 18 litres / min at 6,000rpm for a single stage pump, double that for a 2-stage scavenge.
Anyone got a pic of some Pinto oil pump gears knocking about?
Cheers,
Eddy
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eddymcclements
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| posted on 10/3/06 at 11:38 PM |
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Jon Ison - I'm keen to try your method. I've bought a Westfield dry sump tank off ebay.
and need to make up the housing for oil pump gears. Which do you reckon are easiest to use - Pinto or RV8 gears?
Not sure whether I should try to build a two-stage pump or single-stage and drive it quicker by fitting a smaller pulley.
I already modded my original sump by chopping it, boxing round the oil pickup pipe with trapdoors and fitting a full length horizontal baffle. I have
a spare which I can chop and fit scavenge drains to for the dry-sump project.
Anyone know what the second low-level outlet is on the tank in the pic?
Cheers,
Eddy
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 10/3/06 at 11:42 PM |
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I used pinto gears, is the output an oil temp pick up point ?
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