flak monkey
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 07:51 AM |
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It may open earlier than that, but the std stat opens at 88deg. When the stat opens the top hose and rad will get hot pretty quickly.
If you dont have a bleed in the top of the rad you could try disconnecting the top rad hose while refilling, that should help a bit.
I need to think about how to plumb mine up. But shall start another thread for that!
David
[Edited on 7/6/06 by flak monkey]
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 09:11 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by flak monkey
The large pipe from the thermostat housing allows water to flow from the head to the rad when the thermostat opens at about 88deg.
Is the thermostat that opens the little electronic stat in the top of the rad or the big one with the pipes into it on the block?
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 09:14 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Schrodinger
I also used to have problems bleeding the air from my Cat but used to lift the header off the bracket to get it as high as possible when filling.
Schrodinger, did your Cat flow water back into the tank in normal operation? How did you know if you had air in there and how did you know if it had
gone?
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tks
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 09:16 AM |
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Mhh ok
then i would disconnect the hose from the rado to the pump..
fille using ht ebottle this hose the maximum,
then with a fast move put on the hose on the thermostaat then you shoudl have quet some water in it and not many air..
Tks
anyway when thermost stat opens i think that air would escpay true the housing to the bottle
The above comments are always meant to be from the above persons perspective.
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flak monkey
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 09:19 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Just
Is the thermostat that opens the little electronic stat in the top of the rad or the big one with the pipes into it on the block?
The big one in the block. The one in the rad is the fan switch i should think.
David
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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Schrodinger
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 10:35 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Just
quote:
Originally posted by Schrodinger
I also used to have problems bleeding the air from my Cat but used to lift the header off the bracket to get it as high as possible when filling.
Schrodinger, did your Cat flow water back into the tank in normal operation? How did you know if you had air in there and how did you know if it had
gone?
I had a bleed valve inserted in the rad so that I could ensure there was no air.
As the cylinder head it is above the thermostat, the outlet from the head between the carbs should not be blocked off as there is no easy way for air
to get out of the head and could be causing some of your problems.
You could also try drilling a small hole in the flange of the thermostat to let the air through on filling and would not drastically effect the
working of the stat. I do know that some people who have had problems with their Tigers have left the thermostat out all together.
[Edited on 7/6/06 by Schrodinger]
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 12:08 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by flak monkeyThe large hose from the bottom of the rad to the water pump is the water return to the block.
When you fill the header tank the water is going down pipe B, filling the rad, then the engine via pipe D. Problem is, air cant get out of the rad as
the thermostat will be closed, meaning pipe C is effectively blocked off. Pipe A will let air out of the engine as its the other side of the
thermostat.
David
David, am I right in thinking then that the rad will always get hot at the bottom first? On page one a couple of the guys thought this was very
wrong?
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flak monkey
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 12:14 PM |
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Rad should get hot from the top as thats where the thermostat allows the hot water into the rad. The pump then draws the cooler water out of the
bottom of the rad.
David
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 12:27 PM |
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Ah ok, so until I get the rad heating from the top down I have issues?
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 12:40 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by NS Dev
Yep, to echo what syd said, you should have small hose from any high points in the system (usually thermostat housing, top of rad etc) back to the
header tank to make the system bleed its own air out.
Do all this first, if you still have probs come back on again as there is another less fortunate possibility if you got it really hot when you drove
it very low on water!
I tested for pressure in the thermostat <> rad pipe last night when firing the engine up and there was none, so I am hoping that the less
fortunate possibility has not occurred. It would seem then, that if my return from the thermostat housing back to the header is ok (although water
more than air) and therefore no air in engine, I just need a pipe from the rad to the header (or in my case get the drill out between say the stat and
top pipe) in order to ensure the rad has no air either?
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tks
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 12:46 PM |
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naah come on guys!!!
Look how he connected the stuff!!
he have the bottle connected to lower rad position..
and the lower rad is pump input!
sow its normal that the rad heats up because thats where the water is sucked from!
If you don't want this you have to options.
Block of the smaller rad outlet.
and put a T piece in the big pump input hose to the engine..
connect to that the bottle.
Then your rad won't heat up simply because there is no water circuit in it!
JUST let we put it like this:
You have the situation pretty normal.
the only thing i would mod is the T piece
(sow your rad cant cool down the engine)
and i would add a bleed screw in the rad (on top of it) or make us a picture sow we can see its shape..
Tks
The above comments are always meant to be from the above persons perspective.
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 02:56 PM |
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Ok, so I took the pipe C off at the rad and water poured from the top of the rad. I took it off at the thermostat housing end and water poured from
the engine. Could I still have air in the rad?
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 04:31 PM |
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Ok, one more thought - if I start it and get it up to 80 or so and then short the fan, if I see a drop in temp (or even a maintained level no higher)
would this prove that the system is totally ok or could there still be a risk of air even if this is true?
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tks
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 04:46 PM |
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do this
Near the carbs there was a hose right?
open it while engine is running,
if you get the fullhose filled with water coming out then short it again..
then you are sure all air is out.
in fact the same for the other closed hose
also think about the T piece
because when you have cold engine and are driveing it would take engine more time to warmup and thats exactly what you don´t want.
Sow TIG up a T piece
Cheers
The above comments are always meant to be from the above persons perspective.
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 05:58 PM |
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Thanks, I don't think I need a T-piece as I am not fussed about warm up I just need to know if I have air in there or whether I am good to go
driving?
The pipe on the side is more than likely the PCV I think.
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 07:58 PM |
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Apologies for my continued badgering, but I think I am progressing.
Before starting tonight, I checked the level and woah! it had dropped a lot. So, topped up and ran it again. This time the rad warmed up at the top
much quicker, only just behind the bottom really.
I ran it until the engine got to about 70 degs then shorted the thermostat for the fan. The fan came on and was able to hold the 70 degs for few
minutes.
Eventually the water came over the top of the header again but not with such 'bubbliness' as usual just a smooth rise. I switched off (as
I always do when it over flows) and it stopped overflowing almost instantly this time (sometimes it carries on flowing over for a bit).
So, suspecting that this may just be natural rising due to no cap on, I put the cap on and started again. This time the engine spluttered to a halt
after about a minute, but I suspect (hope) that this is due to a dead battery as I have started and ran the engine 8-10 times with no charging this
week.
So, does it sound like I am heading in the right direction? My next plan is to check the level tomorrow when it has cooled and either way, lift the
tank up again while running it to see if it overflows, then let it cool, top it up and repeat until I can't get it to go lower. It would appear
that I haven't been getting the air out because the tank wasn't high enough.
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rusty nuts
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 08:09 PM |
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By the sound of it your last post gave us a clue. You have put the fan belt on haven't you?
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flak monkey
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 08:10 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by rusty nuts
By the sound of it your last post gave us a clue. You have put the fan belt on haven't you?
Classic 
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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Just
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 08:12 PM |
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yeah worth checking all the basics with me, but no the fanbelt is on, but the alternator doesn't charge at idle (the light stays on, on the
dash). I had expected it to run out of juice in the end.
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flak monkey
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 08:13 PM |
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Sounds like your alternators on the way out too then...
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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rusty nuts
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| posted on 7/6/06 at 08:18 PM |
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Wasn't sure if the pictures were before or after . For future reference if you drain the cooling system it would be worth taking off the hose
from the thermostat housing and checking that outlet isn't blocked , common if engine hasn't been used with antifreeze . Also with the
pipe off the cooling system will self bleed easier .
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Just
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| posted on 8/6/06 at 06:48 AM |
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Thanks Rustynuts, will do.
After three hours on the batt charger the engine still won't start - should I charge it for longer even if it says it's full?
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