novacaine
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 08:41 PM |
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Locost Twin Turbo without selling your limbs
i thought that title would get you all drooling  , well anyway, heres my proposal.....
take a run-of-the-mill 2.0l Pinto (free with a rusty sierra)
give it some pistions and con rods that were quickly removed from someones sierra cosworth at traffic lights whilst they wernt looking (thats a joke
by the way )
build a megasquirt and megajolt system for it
custom inlet and exhaust header
Two turbos pinched off identical turbo diesel cars from a scrappy
Port the heads with the trusty old dremel
can anyone see any obvious problems with this so long as the scavenged parts are in good working order?
can i actualy use a TDi turbo on a petrol engine?
cheers for your help
Matt
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but its sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again, the sun is the same in a relative way but
your older, shorter of breath and one day closer to death
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phoenix70
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 08:44 PM |
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I always thought that desiel turbo's were low pressure turbos, not much use on a petrol car. Not sure I'm right but hey ho
Cheers
Scott
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Wadders
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 08:46 PM |
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IIRC TDi turbos are no good for petrol engines, as the fuel knackers the seals.
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garage19
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 08:49 PM |
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The diesel turbos will be all wrong. The compressor to turbine ratio will be all wrong.
Also the turbine wheels in diesel turbo ar made of cheaper materials as they don't have to resist the higher EGTs of a petrol engine.
What you need is two turbos from something like a fiat uno turbo.
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novacaine
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 08:51 PM |
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thanks for clearing that up for me, it was just a quick thought, no where on the internet had any info about TDi turbos on petrol cars
well like i said, thanks
Matt
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but its sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again, the sun is the same in a relative way but
your older, shorter of breath and one day closer to death
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novacaine
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 08:52 PM |
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uno turbo is a good idea, renault 5 gtt could also be useful....
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but its sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again, the sun is the same in a relative way but
your older, shorter of breath and one day closer to death
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graememk
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 08:55 PM |
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i bought a new one cost me £300
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Wadders
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 08:59 PM |
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Best get your head in some books, before you make any expensive decisions. Maybe try here
http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_ss_b/202-7834287-1447055?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=turbocharging&Go.x=0&Go.y=0&am
p;Go=Go
Originally posted by novacaine
thanks for clearing that up for me, it was just a quick thought, no where on the internet had any info about TDi turbos on petrol cars
well like i said, thanks
Matt
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wilkingj
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 09:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Wadders
IIRC TDi turbos are no good for petrol engines, as the fuel knackers the seals.
Also they can melt. the exhaust temperature on a diesel is considerably lower than a petrol engine. Due to the volatility of diesel compared with
petrol. Another reason why normal Diesels dont rev past 4k ish, and petrols do 6k rpm without much help.
Forget a diesel turbo on a petrol engine. Also the turbine and pump vanes have different features.
If using a Pinto and you want to beef it up... use a set of Diesel Conrods. It requires a little work but they tend not to break.
1. The point of a journey is not to arrive.
2. Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Best Regards
Geoff
http://www.v8viento.co.uk
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Wadders
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 09:03 PM |
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And you might be suprised how quick a locost is, with that free bog standard 2 litre pinto under the bonnet
Originally posted by novacaine
thanks for clearing that up for me, it was just a quick thought, no where on the internet had any info about TDi turbos on petrol cars
well like i said, thanks
Matt
[Edited on 28/12/06 by Wadders]
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novacaine
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 09:03 PM |
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thatks for the link, i think ill but that in the morning
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but its sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again, the sun is the same in a relative way but
your older, shorter of breath and one day closer to death
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novacaine
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 09:06 PM |
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yea i would imagine a locost is quick with the standard item but my friend has a 400bhp evo that he absoloutley slaughters me with on a regular
basis...
i want to be able to keep up with him
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but its sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again, the sun is the same in a relative way but
your older, shorter of breath and one day closer to death
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Howlor
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 09:28 PM |
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300zx Twin Turbo V6 lump
L
inky
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 09:32 PM |
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Far less aggro to just put in a Vauxhall or bike engine, you'll never stay with a quick Evo above 100mph regardless of how much power you have
due to aerodynamcis, but below three figures you'll easily keep up in a 200bhp Vx / Zetec or a 150bhp+ BEC.
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novacaine
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 09:42 PM |
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strangely engough that brings me onto my next project that i have already bought books on, i am going to try to redesign the nose end of the car and
the windscreen area of the car to hopefully bring the drag coefficient of 0.6 down to about 0.35 - 0.4 which should bring it in line with the evo....i
have an areodynamics modeling program on order, i will let you all know if i am successful or not lol
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but its sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again, the sun is the same in a relative way but
your older, shorter of breath and one day closer to death
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PAUL FISHER
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 09:42 PM |
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Your not going to gain any real advantage fitting twin turbos to a the old pinto,over just fitting a single turbo,most twin turbo engines are V
configuration,so each turbo feeds each bank and run independantly,unless your looking at twin sequential turbo's which are fitted to a few
cars,rx7,legacys B4's,and supra's,but a sequential system would be, very complex to set up,as they need to operate in conjunction with
each other,you would be better off just fitting one turbo off something like a EVO.
good luck with the build
[Edited on 19/05/04 by PAUL FISHER]
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froggy
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 10:06 PM |
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at the risk of being flamed there are a few diesel turbos that have been used on petrol engines with great results but the turbos usually come from
huge diesels and used on largeish petrol engines ,ie holset hx35 fitted to cummins diesels in pick up trucks over the pond and plant engines over here
being use on volvo,s 325bm,s , v6 3.5 litre mustang engines and various honda 2.0 engines too. the compressor maps on the larger diesel units seem to
match up with the reqiurements for a larger petrol engine and based on the cfm of my 4.0 rover lump the turbo im using isnt far off plus its a
roller bearing unit and half the price of anything else that might do the job. the best book ive found is maximum boost by corky bell ,its all
american but it takes the mystery out of it for us amateurs
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Simon
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 10:41 PM |
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I have heard rumours that the turbo on Nic Mann's Morris Minor was orf a diesel!
Like I said, I heard rumours.
If I were you, I'd look at doing things by spending a little more money. You don't want to buy turbo's and make manifolds/modify
plenums and programme MS to find it doesn't work well, not for what may end up with only 200bhp.
Says he, who's bought turbo's (from an S4), modified intercoolers (From R5 GTT) and made manifolds/modified plenums, making new exhausts
and making big changes to the bodywork............
But I am hoping for 300 bhp for under £750
You may be better off starting with a more modern engine to start with!
ATB
Simon
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RazMan
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 10:50 PM |
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As already mentioned, I doubt that a twin turbo setup would be viable on a 4 pot engine. If you want to play with 2 turbos surely you need a V engine
Cheers,
Raz
When thinking outside the box doesn't work any more, it's time to build a new box
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greggors84
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| posted on 29/12/06 at 12:25 AM |
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Re the twin turbos, if you were making your own manifold you could maybe use a turbo each for 2 of the cylinders, but then would the exhaust gas split
between the two turbos give half the boost? I guess it depends how powerful you want to go. But 2 small turbos would mean less lag than one big
one.
The other more feasible way is to use a small turbo and a big one so that the small one give lower down power and when the engine revs go up the
bigger one spools up and you get the top end power.
This is all based on my limited understanding of turbos and im sure someone will correct me!
Of course as said you would probably get the same power from a VX XE on bike throttle bodies and MS ecu. Less hassle and cost too.
I dont see why people spend hundreds on pintos when they can get a lighter twin cam with more power for the amounts they are spending. As soon as I
have some money for more power Im starting with a new engine. I can understand it if its for competition for an 8v class or maybe people have
sentimental attatchments to their big lumps of iron!
Chris
The Magnificent 7!
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novacaine
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| posted on 29/12/06 at 10:54 AM |
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that was my main idea, much less turbo lag with two small units than one big one
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but its sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again, the sun is the same in a relative way but
your older, shorter of breath and one day closer to death
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Ivan
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| posted on 29/12/06 at 03:33 PM |
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Going back some 30 years I seem to recall an article by David Vizard in Car & Car Conversions magazine re turbo charging a 2l pinto motor.
If memory serves me right - and it may well not after all these years  - he said 350 hp was easy using a turbo + Chev v8 pistons and con rods. A
cheap combo and now with fuel injection much easier to do!. I think he wrote a book on this subject.
Of course why go to all that trouble when cheap Nissan &/or Volvo turbo motors are available that will easily put out 250 hp + with minimal
research, hastle and risk and be much lighter
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Volvorsport
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| posted on 29/12/06 at 04:40 PM |
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hmm , a turbo thread .
diesel turbos can be used , the seals arenty usually as good since they see no vacuum , but that was a while ago . i can testify to quite a few
holsets on volvo motors , all pushing over 600 hp .
two small turbos will still be inefficient at higher boost pressure , and not spool any quicker either due to reduced air mass through the turbine .
diesels do generally run higher boost pressures .
pick a single turbo like a mitsubishi tdo4 and itll be fully boosted by 2000 rpm , so you are wasting your time running twin turbos on a 4 pot ,
unless you compound charge them both , but that would mean running at least 20-30 psi - not something your aged old pinto will be able to do without a
bit of prep .
but as before a decent single turbo can do all that , less hassle , cheaper etc .
for the hassle at least turbo a zetec , youll get more power back out of it .
www.dbsmotorsport.co.uk
getting dirty under a bus
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Wadders
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| posted on 29/12/06 at 07:04 PM |
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This might give you some inspiration
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