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Dirty linen - public washing.
zilspeed - 9/4/06 at 03:49 PM

Does anyone else find this distasteful in the extreme.

I'm not going to mention any threads - you all know what I'm talking about - but today I see another. It's almost like a public flogging or, if you like, more like "let's discuss private matters in public, then I'll embarass you into delivering a result".

Sorry lads - don't much like this trend. Still, you're all adults, I'm sure that in the fullness of time you'll be glad you made the decisions you have made.

rusty nuts - 9/4/06 at 04:23 PM

Have to agree , perhaps a poll to gauge peoples feelings?

Triton - 9/4/06 at 04:30 PM

Sometimes it can be worthwhile but mostly it only creates bad feeling and distrust.

So resisted temptation to post what I should have perhaps posted

zilspeed - 9/4/06 at 04:36 PM

quote:
Originally posted by rusty nuts
Have to agree , perhaps a poll to gauge peoples feelings?


To be fair, I don't see the point. People are going to do what they're going to do.

Personally, I'd rather sort an issue out between myself on the other party. Doing it any other way always reflects badly on both parties.

Jubal - 9/4/06 at 04:55 PM

I'm not sure on this one. Just cos it's our hobby doesn't mean the suppliers we use can run their businesses like a hobby too. But allowing naming and shaming is also open to massive abuse. It's a tough call.

nige - 9/4/06 at 05:00 PM

NOT IN SUPPORT OF ANYONE

surely if a person comes on here and does
trade and makes profit , but then fails to deliver , what wrong with people expressing their disgust all be it in a constructive and non adusive manner

dave1888 - 9/4/06 at 05:22 PM

Fully agree with Zil Why reply to these "threads" everybody seems to be saying "boring" "zzzzzzzzzz". get over it etc etc. It just makes things worst. It only adds fuel to the fire, if it doesn't concern you just let it be, let both parties sort it out between them. IMHO its childish to either post or reply to these theads.

fesycresy - 9/4/06 at 06:13 PM

Pointing out bad service can be as useful as commending the good.

I was going to build a different kit until I tried to speak to them over the phone, they didn't seem to have the time of day for me. There are plenty of satisfied customers out there for this manufacturer so no need to slag them off in public. I took my money elsewhere.

General whinging where the fault's six of one and half a dozen of the other should be kept private, you know when this is the case. Only when you feel down right robbed or really agrieved, it should be brought to light.

john_p_b - 9/4/06 at 06:22 PM

takes a long time to build a good reputation but a matter of hours to lose it all.

i can see both sides of it really, if a customer is genuinly being taken for a mug by a supplier then it's fair to warn others that could be parting with thier hard earned. but then on the other side of the coin you could get a customer who is simply a awkward bugger who likes to moan trashing the reputation of a good buisness.

ebay style ratings maybe the way to go?

andybod - 9/4/06 at 06:45 PM

and i was hoping for a nws thread with naughty pictures can we all go back to being nice people please i'm having to spend more time sitting talking to the wife as i've spent less time on hear recently and that just won't do

David Jenkins - 9/4/06 at 07:04 PM

If I see a whingeing thread starting up I just don't bother to read it any more, particularly when raised by certain people (who WILL remain nameless)

If everyone did that, these bothersome topics would die a natural death quite rapidly.

David

Deckman001 - 9/4/06 at 07:26 PM

So that's what i did wrong with the hubs, I got them made before i accepted money from buyers, dam thought i did it wrong

Still a few sets left as well !!

Jason

Fozzie - 9/4/06 at 08:50 PM

quote:
Originally posted by john_p_b
takes a long time to build a good reputation but a matter of hours to lose it all.

i can see both sides of it really, if a customer is genuinly being taken for a mug by a supplier then it's fair to warn others that could be parting with thier hard earned. but then on the other side of the coin you could get a customer who is simply a awkward bugger who likes to moan trashing the reputation of a good buisness.

ebay style ratings maybe the way to go?


I totally agree John! I think its the latter that has been taking precedence of late, sadly!
If I order from a supplier on here, I always do it by u2u or email, which ever is the suppliers preferred method privately.
I do not understand why some people choose to order, or contact the supplier on the 'open' forum.
The people I do feel have a genuine reason to say something on the forum, are those that live in much different time zones to us (international), and are having genuine problems contacting suppliers/traders during working hours because of the time difference.
Anyway thats my 2pence worth!

ATB Fozzie

MikeRJ - 9/4/06 at 11:24 PM

quote:
Originally posted by dave1888
Fully agree with Zil Why reply to these "threads" everybody seems to be saying "boring" "zzzzzzzzzz". get over it etc etc. It just makes things worst. It only adds fuel to the fire, if it doesn't concern you just let it be, let both parties sort it out between them. IMHO its childish to either post or reply to these theads.


I fully agree, it IS between the two parties to sort it out themselves which is why making public posts on here is distainfull at best. It should be handled via phone, email or even snail mail. Trying to win support with public posts over what should be a private issue is just plain childish.

MikeP - 10/4/06 at 12:41 AM

As a consumer, I appreciate the information and understand the motive. Suppliers have us hostage, they have our money and we have very little leverage. Using an open forum seems like a good way to force a response and can warn others.

The consumer can state his case, the supplier can respond. If it's libel the supplier can take legal action (bad suppliers aren't bothered by forcing us to do the same).

Sure, it should be a last resort. Obviously posting here will destroy any good will remaining. But in these cases it sounded like they'd stopped making progress using other methods. It sure seems easy to figure out who's at fault with what I've seen so far.

I do agree that input from others is of little use other than making the thread more interesting to read and keeping it alive... Unless they're party to the disagreement, outside opinions aren't worth the ether they're written in.

NS Dev - 10/4/06 at 10:28 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Jubal
I'm not sure on this one. Just cos it's our hobby doesn't mean the suppliers we use can run their businesses like a hobby too. But allowing naming and shaming is also open to massive abuse. It's a tough call.


I agree BUT.........

a lot of the smaller "one man band" suppliers ARE run partially as a hobby/passion. This is the principle reason that they are cheap.

If they were run strictly as a fully profit making business that ALWAYS covered it's costs, never had complaints etc etc then we would all be paying much more for our parts.

We also tend to like "exclusive" and "one off" parts on here, but then because they "look like" a common mass produced part think that the one off should cost the same, bad news is, the one off will be massively more expensive.

My mate runs into this all the time, with his stainless fabrication work.

He's doing stuff for my 7 at the mo (fuel tank, brake reservoir, rad header, all in mirror finished stainless)

The prices he quotes are not cheap, but what he sells are one offs and specials almost exclusively, and that almost invariably means making a prototype at his cost to make sure it works properly, and to establish best practice for manufacture.

Business in the "locost" market is anything but simple, anyone who says it is is a fool!

NS Dev - 10/4/06 at 10:32 AM

quote:
Originally posted by MikeP

.............. But in these cases it sounded like they'd stopped making progress using other methods. It sure seems easy to figure out who's at fault with what I've seen so far...........


one has to be careful making statements like that!

Yes, there have been a LOT of comments made about certain suppliers, and when the vast majority declare a problem, there probably is one, but sometimes statements made by individuals are NOT the truth and are a somewhat "artistic" interpretation of actual events.

David Jenkins - 10/4/06 at 10:38 AM

The only way you can be sure of top-grade service is to pay more money. As the old saying goes:

You can have it good,
You can have it cheap,
You can have it quick.
Pick 2 and get back to me.

Some Locost suppliers manage all 3 together, but they are rare and it doesn't take much to throw them off course. It doesn't help that some excellent suppliers are hopeless businessmen.

If you want best possible service then pay more money and get a Westfield. A fair amount of your money will go into customer support, off-the-shelf spares, design and so on. Otherwise, get familiar with your potential supplier as early as possible and make a judgement on their ability to supply, deal with problems, and so on.

I'm not trying to justify or excuse some of the reported problems - just suggesting that buyers should be more realistic and a lot more careful.


regards,
David

[Edited on 10/4/06 by David Jenkins]

Triton - 10/4/06 at 07:13 PM

A businessman would take one look at the kit car industry and walk away......99% of firms are run by enthusiasts for enthusiasts and if it pays the bills and puts food on the table then that's a bonus.

Someone you all know said to me when I first did the Stoneme show..."it's the best job in the world boy, but you won't earn loadsa money".......How right that fella was.

Mark