Don't know if this is the correct section, or if you guys would be intrested.

Was looking at building a locost for a while, then realised how cheap a RX8 with a dead engine has become. This got me thinking (never a good thing). After a bit of deliberation & measuring of engines, I decided to try & stick a 1.8 20v turbo in one.

I've decided that I'm going to do an engine swap in my track car project. More out of curiosity than anything else.
I've seen a few projects done, but with no real world feedback.

Here's some of the things I'll try show.
•REAL & FULL cost of conversion.
•Time actually spent working on car.
•How car compares once finished (if finished) have my other RX8 to compare it with.
•Cost of any engine modifications. (Again if finished)

I'll keep editing this first post with costs & times.

COSTS.
•RX8 £200
•Transporting RX8 £90
• Audi engine, loom, ecu & gearbox(will be sold on) £200

TIME.
•Removing engine & box from Audi 1:15 (was just over an hour, will round things up to the nearest 15 mins)
• Remove engine from RX8 2.30 (lots of swearing evolved [-X )
• Sit block in place & take some measurements, experiment with what clutch could work. (Time including picking up parts 2.30

TOTAL TIME SO FAR. = 6.15


If you can think of anything else, just post up & I'll add it on.
I have no time limit on this, but will do my best not to let it drag on forever. Finishing off a xr2 turbo track car for a friend over the next week then this is top of the list. :wink:

Engine I will be using is the VAG 1.8 20v turbo, not my first choice of engine. But had to make a few compromises. Cheap & plenty available. Massive market for tuning & one of the main reasons was, easy to use standard ecu.

This is the RX8 I bought with low compression for £200




Got the car dropped off to remove the engine from.









I'll do my best to answer any questions as I go. :wink:

Cheers John

[Edited on 21/8/15 by john-t5]

Finally got the xr2 I was restoring & convering to a turbo finished & MOT'd last month.







So after taking a few weeks off the REX has finally made it into the garage. :mrgreen:

Cheers John

Removed the engine. Lots of seized & snapped bolts, as the car has been lying by the sea in Wick for 2 years before I bought her. #-o











Now the hard work starts. Collect a loan of a mockup block later this week.

Cheers John

Well picked up a lone of a scrap block for mock up, so stuck it in to take a few measurements.


Also got donated a few old flywheels & clutches to have a play with. Have found a mix that might work. 1.9 tdi a4 solid flywheel (if I can find one at a reasonable price) with a 4x4 Sierra Cosworth friction plate & Audi pressure plate. Fly would need a lip machined on it to take the rx8 starter ring gear. Or get a custom fly made to take rx8 clutch. Once adapter plate arrives I can take final measurements & make a decision.
So most of my time has been spent like this. :roll:


Another 2 1/2 hours spent. Including picking up parts donated.

Cheers John

Posts copied from another forum, just to bring things upto how it stands at the moment. Any feedback, criticism or advice is welcomed.

Cheers John

Very interesting,shame to not have to proper engine in there,but will watch ya progress.

Great stuff.

Insurance will be expensive due to the official cc increase.

Love the Fords, xr2 looks good in green but sorry the sierra would look million $$$$ better in grey, black or white.

I look forward to reading more.

I'lll be keeping an eye on this, I've often wonder whether there is a viable option to convert the 1.8 VAG engine to RWD. As you say there are huge tuning options, even the variations in factory engines give a variety of powers (150 to >200 if memory serves, and that's without aftermarket parts).

As you say atrong engines. The highest spec was the BAM engine which had 225hp in the standard tt and seat Leon chorus R. There was a special version in the tt sport with 250hp.

I had a 225 cupra r remapped to 290hp with no mods other than a stronger waste gate.

Nice project

[Edited on 21/8/15 by tegwin]

If there was a rear drive conversion for the VAG group engines I'd defo be considering that. I've had VWs since I was 21 just recently got and Audi daily. My Mk4 R32 (supercharged) is my other toy. The 1.8t has bags of potential and loads of them about, what sort of size is it though? Thoughts around fitting one in a 7 trype car. I guess you need an adapter plate or custom bellhousing to mate it to a type 9 or something like that.

Keep up the progress and lots of photos please.

Great project, watching with interest

Donkervoort use many Audi engines in rwd format

quote:

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Originally posted by nero1701
Donkervoort use many Audi engines in rwd format

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Cheers for the intrest guys. I'll do my best to keep this as updated with info, cost & times as possible. Not much will get done this weekend touring cars up here.

Cheers John

quote:

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Originally posted by dubzter
If there was a rear drive conversion for the VAG group engines I'd defo be considering that. I've had VWs since I was 21 just recently got and Audi daily. My Mk4 R32 (supercharged) is my other toy. The 1.8t has bags of potential and loads of them about, what sort of size is it though? Thoughts around fitting one in a 7 trype car. I guess you need an adapter plate or custom bellhousing to mate it to a type 9 or something like that.

---

Not found anyone doing one for the VAG engine to Mazda yet. Rayland used to sell them. Do you have a link.

Cheers John

Sweet project, I shall watch with interest!

Quote from April PPC... Martin Harland at Reyland Motorsport is well underway with a conversion kit...

It goes on to describe the simple bolt up option with the gearbox adaptor plate. There's pictures of the vag engine in the rx8 engine bay.

It also shows one with a Honda engine in and one with a supra engine and one with a Chevy LS V8 yum yum...

LS1RX8.com
pakwheels.com

Martin never finished his & has removed all details from his website.

Cheers John

quote:

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Originally posted by maccmike
Great stuff.

Insurance will be expensive due to the official cc increase.

Love the Fords, xr2 looks good in green but sorry the sierra would look million $$$$ better in grey, black or white.

I look forward to reading more.

---

Time to get a bit high tech and brake out the CAD (cardboard adided design) to get a wooden mock up adapter plate made up. Let's hope it works.

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[Edited on 27/8/15 by john-t5]

Offered wooden mock up plate up to the vw engine, fits great. Can't beleave it

Adapter plate looks like it will work, will need to make the real one now. Can cut bulkhead & make engine mounts while I wait.



Cheers John

Nice project!

Were you at our last TT meet at Eurocentral? Can't imagine there's many green Cossies.

Saw your Sierra at Knockhill on Sunday, nice colour. What is It?.

Stu

Hi guys, yip I was at Euro central last month. Missed this one, due to being at my mates wedding on track a knockhill. Car is wrapped apple green. Been done for 3 years now, starting to fade bubble & rip. Time to tidy her up & paint her now she's being retired from track duty.

Cheers John

quote:

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Originally posted by john-t5
Not found anyone doing one for the VAG engine to Mazda yet. Rayland used to sell them. Do you have a link.

Cheers John

---

Spoke to him at fordfair this year. I'm a bit of a pain & like to have a go at doing things myself. But have his number in the emergency dial list.

Cheers John

I read that the VAG engines apart front some V8's all have the same bolt pattern. I was considering fitting a VR6 engine in my sierra as the MT75 has been mated to the VAG 20V before in some kit cars.

Think your right rob, from what I've read any way, all the 4 pot engines have the same bolt pattern.

Got the engine sitting in its final position. Took all measurements from the gearbox on my other rx8 & sat the head on to see where I stand with the bulkhead.



Cut pipes & sound deadening out the way.



Cut out some of the bulkhead, I'm going to have to remove the dash & see what I can do with the heater. Don't know if I'll have any room for it. Need to cut back a bit more to get the engine where I want it.



Cheers John

Decided it was time to strip out the beautiful interior. A job I really wasn't looking forward too.








May have to sacrifice the heater unit. It's massive.


Cheers John

Cut some more out the bulkhead to give me more room.


Inlet now on.


Exhaust manifold on. This won't be the one I'm using, have one with the turbo further forward.


Even enough room for the cam cover now.


View from inside. No need for fancy gauges. Passenger could just lean forward & feel inlet & exhaust temps.


Bonnet even closes.


Cheers John

Looking good, one of these is on my bucket list. keep updating

Plenty of room for cam belt changes that's for sure.

These engines have coil packs mounted on each cylinder if memory serves correctly. They are prone to failure if they get too hot. Can you remove the rear most one with the engine in situ? Looks really tight!?



Cool project though, looking forward to seeing the result

Well coilpack, was a bit of an oversite. But after much head scratching, I've come up with a plan. With the cutting done, you can see the coilpack under the scuttle panel. So after its all welded back up, I'll leave an inspection panel to change the coil pack. Meaning you have to remove the scuttle (a couple of screws) not idea, but better than removing the engine. Well spotted, saves me a headache in the future.

With all that, I didn't do much else. Sat the standard strut brace on to see how far back the engine sits.


Could even put old engine cover back on.


Cheers John

Cool project. Couldn't you just mount the coilpack elsewhere?

It's on plug coilpacks on this engine. Should be all sorted now.

Cheers John

quote:

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Originally posted by Adamirish
Cool project. Couldn't you just mount the coilpack elsewhere?

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quote:

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Originally posted by wylliezx9r

quote:

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Originally posted by Adamirish
Cool project. Couldn't you just mount the coilpack elsewhere?

---

But what about the spark plug ?

---

Yip, coil on plug. All the 1.8 20v turbos are.


Cheers John

Good thread this

Keep the photos coming please

quote:

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Originally posted by Adamirish

quote:

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Originally posted by wylliezx9r


But what about the spark plug ?

---

I didn't know this engine used coil on plug.

---

Nice project, to be watched with some interest.

A colleague had an RX8 a few years ago and I have to be honest, it was a disappointing car to drive fast - rather numb and never felt like it had any real oomph to it.

That's my main reason for doing it. Out on track in the corners , they're great. But get on a straight & you're done.

Hope to get some work done over the weekend, steel to make the adapter plate comes on Wednesday. D

Cheers John

Sorry guys not had much time to spend on the car. But managed to get some time during the week to make the adapter plate.


Made the new bulkhead this weekend. Have left a removable inspection plate, to allow access to the rear of the engine.


Should be enough room for the engine now.


Plan of action for this week is to get engine back in with proper plate, make engine mounts & take final measurments for flywheel.

Hope to keep this post moving & updated now.

Will update time spent ASAP.

Cheers John

Passengers side engine mount tacked up.


All welded up.


Cheers John

Got the drivers side mount tacked up.


All welded up.


Mock up engine in, sitting on its own mounts. Still have proper spacers to make to replace washers.




What do you think so far guys?

Cheers John

Good work. Plenty of room for a big fat intercooler in front of the engine.

Shaping up well, but if it were me I'd triangulate the mounts a bit more. My seatodapants spidey sense likes angled mounts tangentially to the engine's shudder movement.

Yip plenty of room to mount an intercooler. Just not plenty of room to run the pipework.

The more I look at the mounts now, the weaker they look. I'll add some more strength before fitting them to proper engine & when I add spacers I'll triangulate them onto rear of mount too. Cheers, that's why these posts are good. People pick up on small things I might take for granted.

Cheers John

I'm so glad I set an email reminder on this thread, it's nice to look in every now and again to see how it's going.

What was the reason for setting the engine so far into the car, is it purely to keep the gearbox in the same place? If so, why wasn't the rotary so far back?

I'm looking forward to seeing your finished adapter solution, if you manage to get a working combination you could easily make a bob or two selling it as a kit.

Nice to see another idea actually taking shape in an rx8. Lovely looking cars with such a high maintenance engine!

The engine is so far back to try & keep the handling as close to the original rx8 as possible. The rotary engine sits that far back, but is just nowhere near as tall as the VAG lump.

Cheers John

Looks good and a snug fit in the engine bay too.

As before, having driven a rotary engined RX8 I wasn't impresed with it as an engine. Having driven a few VAG 1.8T cars it seems to me a better engine with more pull.

Good luck and keep the photos coming!

Made a start on the loom.




Wish I'd never got one from a Passat. This foam/tar is a nightmare


Have got it this far.


Fair bit still to do before I can start cutting & modding it. :cry:

Cheers John

Just started reading this. Love the VAG engines, so much tuning potential.

Keep us updated !

I've started a thread in the projects forum. I hope you guys will follow it there.

Cheers John