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Author: Subject: Paypal pi$$take
locoboy

posted on 8/10/12 at 04:15 PM Reply With Quote
Paypal pi$$take

This is my reply to paypal when they just informed me that they have decided in the buyers favour when he submitted a 'not received my item' claim 33 days into a 45 day sea freight transit time to Australia.

Lets see if I get a reply tomorrow......

Dear Paypal admin,

I think your are missing the point, it is quite clear that you do not understand what is going on, are you even aware of what method of shipment the goods were sent on or even where they were going?

Here are the facts

I am in England
My customer is in Australia
Shipping time is an estimated 45 days
My contract was to get the goods to the port and NOT TO HIS DOOR ( I am not responsible for DELIVERING the item to him -I have proof that the customer has accepted these terms) and I have proof that the goods are where they should be.
My customer pays for the goods with paypal
The customer fraudulently opens a non recipt of item dispute 33 days after paying for it - remember he know it is not due to be there yet.
You remove MY £1650.00 from MY paypal account as a result of the frauldulent claim submitted by him
I have no option but to request that my shipping agent puts the goods on hold at the port on arival and not release them for collection until I get my money, which, remember was taken by YOU as a result of a FRAUDULENT paypal claim.
You have decided to give the money back to my customer leaving me with a pallet of goods on the other side of the world whch you just flippantly say that I should get them sent back! are you offering to pay for the shipping back to me seeing as you have allowed a fraudulent claim to take place?

.

We currently have aproximately 350 transactions, £14000 of sales going through paypal every month and on top of that we pay £400.00 in paypal fees, for that level of business I expect better customer service than this, please escalate this to your manager and I requst that one of your customer service MANAGERS calls me on 01952 727298 tomorrow between the hours of 8am and 5.00pm to discuss this further.

Fingers crossed for a favourable response otherwise I have an engine sat in the docks in Perth WA!





ATB
Locoboy

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Slimy38

posted on 8/10/12 at 04:35 PM Reply With Quote
Good luck, but knowing Paypals reputation to be forever in the buyers favour I think your engine is going to need to start swimming as it's a long way back to the Midlands...
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MikeRJ

posted on 8/10/12 at 04:44 PM Reply With Quote
Paypal and eBay both have the worst level of customer service I have ever experienced. It's high time there was some kind of investigation into the way they treat their customers. I've had crap service as a buyer as well as a seller.
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jase380

posted on 8/10/12 at 04:58 PM Reply With Quote
As above, in my experience Paypal and Ebay are both a shower of Crunts..
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blakep82

posted on 8/10/12 at 05:00 PM Reply With Quote
wonder what would happen if you raised it with police, as they're aiding fraud?





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liam.mccaffrey

posted on 8/10/12 at 05:10 PM Reply With Quote
Can you take them to small claims court? I doubt they would even bother to turn up and you would win by default.

[Edited on 8/10/12 by liam.mccaffrey]





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jiwillia

posted on 8/10/12 at 05:25 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by locoboy
This is my reply to paypal when they just informed me that they have decided in the buyers favour when he submitted a 'not received my item' claim 33 days into a 45 day sea freight transit time to Australia.

Lets see if I get a reply tomorrow......

Dear Paypal admin,

I think your are missing the point, it is quite clear that you do not understand what is going on, are you even aware of what method of shipment the goods were sent on or even where they were going?

Here are the facts

I am in England
My customer is in Australia
Shipping time is an estimated 45 days
My contract was to get the goods to the port and NOT TO HIS DOOR ( I am not responsible for DELIVERING the item to him -I have proof that the customer has accepted these terms) and I have proof that the goods are where they should be.
My customer pays for the goods with paypal
The customer fraudulently opens a non recipt of item dispute 33 days after paying for it - remember he know it is not due to be there yet.
You remove MY £1650.00 from MY paypal account as a result of the frauldulent claim submitted by him
I have no option but to request that my shipping agent puts the goods on hold at the port on arival and not release them for collection until I get my money, which, remember was taken by YOU as a result of a FRAUDULENT paypal claim.
You have decided to give the money back to my customer leaving me with a pallet of goods on the other side of the world whch you just flippantly say that I should get them sent back! are you offering to pay for the shipping back to me seeing as you have allowed a fraudulent claim to take place?

.

We currently have aproximately 350 transactions, £14000 of sales going through paypal every month and on top of that we pay £400.00 in paypal fees, for that level of business I expect better customer service than this, please escalate this to your manager and I requst that one of your customer service MANAGERS calls me on 01952 727298 tomorrow between the hours of 8am and 5.00pm to discuss this further.

Fingers crossed for a favourable response otherwise I have an engine sat in the docks in Perth WA!


Would you like to tell us his Ebay ID so that we can all steer clear of him in future?

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loggyboy

posted on 8/10/12 at 05:27 PM Reply With Quote
Ebay and Paypal = same people = same levels of money grabbing crap service.






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Jon Ison

posted on 8/10/12 at 05:46 PM Reply With Quote
Think you need to pick the phone up speak to a real person, all you are receiving to date will be copy n paste totally irrelevant replies.
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chillis

posted on 8/10/12 at 06:04 PM Reply With Quote
why so many people won't sell overseas. This is a not untypical rip off by overseas customers. You will need to get the shipper to hold at the destination port and then arange for it to be returned to the uk. Unfortunately you have to suffer these shipping costs. DO NOT under any circumstances allow the shipper to release to the 'customer' - reason non -payment by customer.





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Daddylonglegs

posted on 8/10/12 at 06:46 PM Reply With Quote
When it comes to PayPal and eBay, it's the same as 'Woman' and 'Man' in a divorce settlement, just replace 'Man' with 'seller' and 'Woman' with 'buyer'. They are gonna win everytime, bunch of robbin s*ds!!





It looks like the Midget is winning at the moment......

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Dangle_kt

posted on 8/10/12 at 08:15 PM Reply With Quote

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wilkingj

posted on 8/10/12 at 08:26 PM Reply With Quote
Threaten them with Legal Action.

Mind you they could respond, and you end up with a bigger bill than the goods were worth.

Good luck mate.


Or.. have you spoken with the customer to ask what they are playing at?
Talking to the customer, has to be an option.
They know thay have the money back, ask them to pay you again!
although this might incur more fees.



[Edited on 8/10/2012 by wilkingj]





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cps13

posted on 8/10/12 at 10:03 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
wonder what would happen if you raised it with police, as they're aiding fraud?


Police refuse to deal with ebay disputes of this nature as they are civil matters not criminal. I.e. breach of T&Cs rather than fraud. If any fraud has been committed in this case it has also been committed in Australia not the UK.

I have had the same levels of service from them with no joy. I hope it gets sorted for you!

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mangogrooveworkshop

posted on 9/10/12 at 08:11 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Daddylonglegs
When it comes to PayPal and eBay, it's the same as 'Woman' and 'Man' in a divorce settlement, just replace 'Man' with 'seller' and 'Woman' with 'buyer'. They are gonna win everytime, bunch of robbin s*ds!!





Not everytime






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designer

posted on 9/10/12 at 09:06 AM Reply With Quote
I never use Paypal outside the UK, Germany, France, Benelux and Spain; the rest are too far away!
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locoboy

posted on 9/10/12 at 12:11 PM Reply With Quote
Here you go!

Their reply……
Thank you for contacting PayPal.
When a buyer claims they did not receive their item, we ask the seller to respond to the claim with a tracking number that can be checked online. Tracking information is verified by a postage company and as such is third-party confirmation that an item has been delivered. If we can confirm in this manner that the items have been delivered we are then able to close buyer claims in the seller's favour.
In this case we did not receive any valid tracking information and as such, we were obliged to send a full refund to the buyer.
From reading your email I understand you would like us to call you back. We're an inbound call centre only, and as such, I'm unable to call you back.
To speak to our Customer Service please contact us by phone.

My reply this morning

Are you really that dim and have any of you actually read what I appear to be wasting my time writing?

I WAS NEVER GOING TO DELIVER THE GOODS TO MY CUSTOMER, THEY WERE TO BE DELIVERED TOT HE DOCKS AND MY CUSTOMER WAS TO COLLECT THEM BUT I AM NOT LETTING HIM COLLECT THEM WITHOUT ME HAVING MY MONEY!

Please answer why do PayPal allow cross border payments when your method of deciding if the goods have been delivered does not suit all types of cross border sales?

Again you are missing the point that the dispute was opened without justification and yet again PayPal have done nothing about that, it's time to actually read what your customers are writing to you and apply a bit of human logic rather than the 'computer says no' attitude that seems to be prevalent within the company.

I will be ringing you today and you will be refunding my money, this has been my only cause for contacting customer service since I began using PayPal some 6 years ago and believe me I do not want to have the displeasure of doing it again it is a truly disgusting level of service!
Their reply this afternoon!
Thank you for contacting PayPal.

their reply this afternoon!

From researching your account history, I can see that your issue has been resolved. We are continually improving our customer service to accommodate members' needs and can be contacted by going to the PayPal website and clicking the "Help" link in the upper right side of the page.
Please let us know if you require any further assistance.


Livid does not come close to how I am feeling at this moment!





ATB
Locoboy

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Jon Ison

posted on 9/10/12 at 04:03 PM Reply With Quote
As I said copy n paste answers, I have a number if you want that will get you further than the call center, u2u me if you want/need it.
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jase380

posted on 9/10/12 at 04:28 PM Reply With Quote
They are a complete shower of arxxholes, I returned some roof bars to the seller as they had parts missing and no keys, provided them with a tracking number and proof of delivery.... still refused to refund me and closed the case, then sent me a very similar reply to the one you have there. I'm beginning to think the reason most of these call centres are overseas is so you can't jump in your car and go and stove em in !!
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JoelP

posted on 9/10/12 at 09:24 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by jase380
They are a complete shower of arxxholes, I returned some roof bars to the seller as they had parts missing and no keys, provided them with a tracking number and proof of delivery.... still refused to refund me and closed the case, then sent me a very similar reply to the one you have there. I'm beginning to think the reason most of these call centres are overseas is so you can't jump in your car and go and stove em in !!


The very thing crossed my mind the other day about Orange. If they were local then surely there would be a daily kicking at closing time.





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SteveWalker

posted on 9/10/12 at 09:30 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
quote:
Originally posted by jase380
They are a complete shower of arxxholes, I returned some roof bars to the seller as they had parts missing and no keys, provided them with a tracking number and proof of delivery.... still refused to refund me and closed the case, then sent me a very similar reply to the one you have there. I'm beginning to think the reason most of these call centres are overseas is so you can't jump in your car and go and stove em in !!


The very thing crossed my mind the other day about Orange. If they were local then surely there would be a daily kicking at closing time.


I had major problems with TalkTalk 18 months ago and at one point actually spoke to someone in a UK call centre - he did his best to be helpful when I discovered he was working in a call centre less than 200 yards from my office!

SteveW

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Ninehigh

posted on 9/10/12 at 10:00 PM Reply With Quote
Yep next stage is to call them, and after that send a letter recorded delivery (so they can't blame Royal Mail for not delivering it)






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MikeR

posted on 9/10/12 at 10:04 PM Reply With Quote
ok, look up something called 'ITIL'. Its the process by which you run an IT helpdesk. The principles are great once you know them for dealing with problems like this.

Firstly REMAIN CALM and be persistant. No matter how much of an idiot you're dealing with remain calm. I had some pillock tell me i had to power cycle my fridge freezer every 3 to 4 days as it was a computer and needed resetting. I remained calm did what i'm about to write and got a full refund, apology and promise the agent would receive retraining.


So you're remaining calm - imagine you're speaking to your dotty old aunt who's going to leave you 500k if you don't wee her off.

take the name of the person you're speaking to / emailing. explain your problem, listen to the solution you don't accept. explain you don't accept this and ask what their process is for resolving a call & who their manager is.

follow their process.

make a note of EVERY conversation, who you spoke to, when.

REMAIN CALM - this isn't a fast process, persistence pays off.

If you don't get a response, ask how you escalate, who to.

Eventually you'll get "i'm in charge, i've decided, no escalation". Explain you understand why they've made the decision, they're following process, but you disagree and surely you can see why. You don't want to argue with them, they've done their best, don't want to keep wasting their time as you're sure they're busy and .... who is their manager. Eventually you'll end up with someone who will make a decision and when you present all the crap you've had to go through step by step they'll think a) what a knob recording all that b) we've really messed this person around c) they aint going away and will be hassling my boss next if i don't resolve this.

For me this has worked on a number of occasions. The only problem is it doesn't work for small companies. Paypal isn't small

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Jon Ison

posted on 10/10/12 at 10:40 AM Reply With Quote
Check yur u2u box, some good info in there.
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