motorcycle_mayhem
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 09:04 AM |
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Water Stopcock Help Needed
I need to isolate the water supply. Usual issues with ballcocks, overflows and a corroded rising main isolation tap that's now joined in the
leakage party. Things are getting serious. House is 1980's vintage, clearly things are nearing their design life.
I can't find anything in the roadside meter housing that looks like a stopcock... and no, I haven't been on the stubbies. The cover for
next door also reveals just a meter too. The fire hydrant cover reveals a fire hydrant. All other (much older) homes I've lived in there's
been an obvious stopcock with the meter (if it's had a meter), where's this one?
What am I missing, what am I not seeing? Should I be looking for something else somewhere else?
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mark chandler
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 09:18 AM |
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That's all we have outside, where the water comes in we have a tap, you must have this usually hidden under the kitchen sink cupboard in my
experience although in our case in a riser in the downstairs toilet.
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stevebubs
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 09:23 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mark chandler
That's all we have outside, where the water comes in we have a tap, you must have this usually hidden under the kitchen sink cupboard in my
experience although in our case in a riser in the downstairs toilet.
Think he's found that..
quote:
corroded rising main isolation tap that's now joined in the leakage party
Our house is mid-80s and we have an outside stopcock under a cover on the drive....it's this he's looking for...
http://www.ultimatehandyman.co.uk/how-to/plumbing/isolate-the-water-supply
[Edited on 2/2/15 by stevebubs]
[Edited on 2/2/15 by stevebubs]
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joneh
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 09:24 AM |
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^wot he says. Take out your kitchen plinths, you may get lucky and find it under there.
Edit: Rising Main stopcock is the link to upstairs, not the in to house.
[Edited on 2/2/15 by joneh]
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motorcycle_mayhem
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 09:52 AM |
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Thanks, yep, usual rising main cock is under the kitchen sink as usual. The cock is heavily corroded, covered in salts and leaking badly. To touch
this would not be good, hence the search for something else.
Didn't think too much about it, just flip the meter cover and turn it all off... only to find lack of expected stopcock. The house is not
something I've been in long enough to become familiar with.
If there might be something else under the chipboard, I'll get looking there, thanks. Is it therefore common practice to put another on the
plastic incomer somewhere???????
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INDY BIRD
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 10:05 AM |
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what is in the cover next to the outside water meter?
You normally have a long T rod to turn of the mains in the road,
it has U end at the end of the T bar, have you checked all the covers in the drive etc?
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r1_pete
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 10:29 AM |
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Somewhere on the meter fitting on the inlet pipe side there should be a valve, it could be allen, square, torx fitting, to turn the supply off.
Now you probably don't want to hear this but, they usually break off or sheer, but the water board are responsible.....
[Edited on 2/2/15 by r1_pete]
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motorcycle_mayhem
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 10:38 AM |
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Cover next to the opened one gives access to an identical meter arrangement for next door, no stopcock on that one either.
Larger cover is the fire hydrant. Usual square drive to turn it on, and the 4" pipe socket for the fore hose. All encased lower down in
concrete, but my guess it all interconnects.
I'm off back to the lab. to get some liquid N2 to take out the feed upstairs so I can at least replace the corroded stuff up top and stop the
icicles forming off the overflows(!) That'll keep me busy for a while....
Meanwhile, the stopcock search under the kitchen chipboard revealed the ppe pipe just goes straight down from the rising cock into the concrete.....
hey ho.
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rgrs
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 10:46 AM |
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What in would suggest when you find out how to isolate your water is to it one of these:
surestop linky
I fit these in all my properties and recommend them to all rental owners, they are quick and cheap to fit and enable the water to be isolated at the
push of a switch. No more issues with seized stop taps !
Roger
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James
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 11:04 AM |
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If you're stuck for finding the stop cock I've had similar issues in the past.
The cheap way is to request your water board fit a water meter this has a built-in stop tap. This they will do in the hole in the street you've
pictured (for free). You will then have a stopcock in the street you can use so you can then replace the internal one.
In my first house I had to do 6 weeks of renovations whilst I waited them to fit it- making damn sure I didn't hit a pipe as there was no way to
turn the water off! lol
Good luck!
James
[Edited on 2/2/15 by James]
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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dhutch
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 12:40 PM |
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Ring the waterboard?
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theprisioner
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 12:53 PM |
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In Scotland every house must be fitted with a toby (underground valve) as this is the legal service agreement demarcation point. It is point beyond
which you are responsible. You are entitled to know where this point is without charge from the water board (it will be on their data base). I have
used this service in the past wheen I could not find such a valve and the stop cock is faulty. You must have a stop cock to comply with building
regulations.
http://sylvabuild.blogspot.com/
http://austin7special.blogspot.co.uk/
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rash12
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 01:23 PM |
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if you have a mdpe blue pipe coming in to the house you can use a pipe squeezer if you are really struggling for isolation we do this at work when we
have no isolation .
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HowardB
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 01:56 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by dhutch
Ring the waterboard?
+1
they told me where to find it when I couldn't turned out I had one that was shared over 4 properties. Also the comment about there being a valve
integral to the meter: I have heard that too,...
closer look?
hth
Howard
Fisher Fury was 2000 Zetec - now a 1600 (it Lives again and goes zoom)
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David Jenkins
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 03:42 PM |
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My water meter has a stopcock built in, right next to the body of the thing - totally impossible to turn off without the correct tool... 
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motorcycle_mayhem
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 05:41 PM |
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David - OK, so in the daylight I'll have another look. It *must* be on the body of the damn thing, I've been everywhere looking for other
apertures in the concrete. I don't suppose you've got a picture of the tool to hand, might help me visualise what I'm feeling for
among the hypodermics.
I've managed to replace all the corroded shite up in the loft, but the issue of the leaking kitchen cock remains.
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omega 24 v6
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 05:42 PM |
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The toby outside my house had been concreted over. Called the water board and they came and dug it all up/exposed it and put in a new cover/flap. Then
re concreted it with the new acess point in place.
If it looks wrong it probably is wrong.
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gremlin1234
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 06:04 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by motorcycle_mayhem
David - OK, so in the daylight I'll have another look. It *must* be on the body of the damn thing, I've been everywhere looking for other
apertures in the concrete. I don't suppose you've got a picture of the tool to hand, might help me visualise what I'm feeling for
...
I think your meter is like this one
http://www.gumtree.com/p/other-miscellaneous-goods/water-meter/1016624719
would likely have to brake the seal to turn it off.
can you not freeze the inlet before the stopcock under the sink, and change the stopcock? or cut the pipe and put new stop cock in?
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David Jenkins
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 07:44 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by motorcycle_mayhem
David - OK, so in the daylight I'll have another look. It *must* be on the body of the damn thing, I've been everywhere looking for other
apertures in the concrete. I don't suppose you've got a picture of the tool to hand, might help me visualise what I'm feeling for
among the hypodermics.
I've managed to replace all the corroded shite up in the loft, but the issue of the leaking kitchen cock remains.
I only found mine by reaching down through 8 or 10 inches of water! I could feel the tab that's attached to the valve, but couldn't turn
it. When the plumber came to rearrange some pipework I left it to him to sort it out (he also fitted a brand-new stopcock in my garage in a prominent
place for future use).
Probably I'd have to use a tool like this.
[Edited on 2/2/15 by David Jenkins]
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JoelP
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 07:47 PM |
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Just to agree that the water supply company have a duty to provide isolation outside your property. I've called so many times I can remember
their number! Tell them there's a leak that you can't isolate and they should prioritise you. Esp if they thought there was a baby or old
dear in the house 
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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motorcycle_mayhem
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| posted on 2/2/15 at 08:49 PM |
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Dave - yep, thanks. I do have two such tools from previous houses. One a beautifully machined version, the other exactly as per the link. Both fit
(and have fitted) all stopcocks that I've come across.
This one simply has nothing in the hole. The well is so narrow that there is no provision for a tool, other than a screwdriver to hit the concrete at
the bottom.
There must be something else somewhere.
Water Board will be contacted tomorrow. The epoxy putty bodge I've moulded over the rising kitchen cock to stop the leak should prioritise
things...
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geoff shep
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| posted on 3/2/15 at 09:30 AM |
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Where is your cock leaking from? Ahem!
I need to change mine really as it weeps a bit whenever I turn it off and on. It leaks from the tap insert and I can usually fix it by tightening the
nut round the spindle. I suspect that the insert it self can be changed too rather than the whole stopcock.
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motorcycle_mayhem
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| posted on 10/2/15 at 08:07 AM |
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Cock Update:
Severn Trent Water (man with van) got involved yesterday.
The reason why I can't find a stop tap around the meter, is because the meter is the stop tap. I had come to this conclusion very early on, so
no surprise. Meter is simply rotated through 90 degrees to isolate the supply, or that was the idea about 25 years ago... several hours, a few more
vans and several tools later we had a water 'feature' in the road. This morning, I had a skating rink!
There will now be a 'priority' replacement of the meter, with an external cock, by the weekend.
Story is that these meters were fitted to new builds ca. 25 years ago for a very limited period. When they cause 'issues' (as they are
starting to) they are replaced with something more reliable. However, the older 'assets' are not routinely replaced, the strategy is to
await failure. Since there are 16 identical meters in the close, feeding each shoebox, I guess any resident that attempts to isolate the supply will
be in for the same grief.
So, hopefully by the weekend, I should get a supply I can turn off to address the mass of corroded brass and copper than constitutes my shoebox
plumbing. Thankfully, there's not much of it.
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David Jenkins
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| posted on 10/2/15 at 05:33 PM |
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I read the first line as "Cock-up date"!
After reading the rest, I wasn't far wrong...
Glad they're fixing it for you though.
[Edited on 10/2/15 by David Jenkins]
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James
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| posted on 10/2/15 at 05:52 PM |
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Glad it got/getting resolved!
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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