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Author: Subject: xflow oil pressure problem search ?
Deckman001

posted on 7/3/21 at 12:14 PM Reply With Quote
xflow oil pressure problem search ?

Hi all xflow users.

Have tried searching for previous posts but no results come up.

My 1600 xflow has been rebuilt using new bearings, seals and piston rings. The head is also refurbished. Before it was rebuilt, the oil pressure was fine but it had a few oil leaks from various places.
Now rebuilt, it started off with the same looking pressure, but having been fired up about 10 to 20 times, and being driven for about 5 miles as a shake down and self centring run, the oil pressure gauge shows only about 10 psi at tick over and about 20 when revved. it is running slightly hot it feels although the fan keeps it under control. There is no sign of oil in the catch tank and only a slight leak from around the rocker cover gasket, although this has reduced a lot.

Am curious to know what other xflow users think about it before i buy a high pressure oil pump to try and raise the numbers. At no point has the oil light come on apart from when not running. And the oil level is between the min and max so should be fine. The type of oil is thicker (for classics) than i have used before, and it was recommended by my engine helper who is helping me get the car past the IVA retest. He thinks the h/p pump is needed.

Jason

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rusty nuts

posted on 7/3/21 at 12:55 PM Reply With Quote
What type of oil pressure gauge do you have? I find electric gauges can be a bit suspect and prefer the type with an oil line , worth checking with a workshop type gauge ? Oil pressure relief valve can cause problems by sticking,which can affect pressure they can be cleaned . When I rebuilt my engine I used some cheap 20/50 but after 500 miles I changed to Valvoline 20/50 which improved oil pressure considerably. Might be worth double checking your ignition timing and carb settings which can cause increased temperature if incorrect. Water Wetter can reduce engine temperature as can bonnet vents , if the fan is having to cool the engine now it may struggle in warmer weather?
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obfripper

posted on 7/3/21 at 01:26 PM Reply With Quote
Is it a mechanical or electronic gauge?
If it's electronic, i would check the accuracy of the displayed pressure as they can give you misleading figures.

If accurate, your stated pressures are at the minimum end of xflow hot pressures, being 8.5 psi idle and 21 psi at 2000rpm, but even then you should have higher pressures at cold start.

A drop in pressure could also be the relief valve not closing properly, either due to contamination, wear or a weak spring.

The old way of upping the oil pressure was a 1/4"/6.3mm spacer under the relief valve spring, should give 15 psi more hot oil pressure.
Most uprated pressure pumps have this as a modification, some will have an uprated spring, but there isn't a correct off the shelf item.

The oil pressure light only needs 2.5 psi to go out, so is only useful to tell you when the pump has expired!


Dave

[Edited on 7/3/21 by obfripper]

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steve m

posted on 7/3/21 at 02:13 PM Reply With Quote
I would go with releif valve not seating properly

take the pump off, and with the mating side facing you, you will see a little washer clip, put a screwdriver in the hole and prise it off
i would do this in a carrier bag, as the spring under there will go like a missile !!

cleann it all up, stick a little washer under the spring, assemble and drift the washer back into the pump

ivbe done this many many times !!

steve





Thats was probably spelt wrong, or had some grammer, that the "grammer police have to have a moan at




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Deckman001

posted on 7/3/21 at 02:45 PM Reply With Quote
Cheers all, It's an electronic gauge, and it showed good pressures before the rebuild, and straight away when re started, so it's just a drop in pressure since the rebuild really.

I haven't done anything to the oil pump side of things as before the rebuild, it all seamed perfect. Timing was checked and looked very good, Emissions are perfect on tick over so am hoping that isn't the possible extra heat. One thought i do have though is the fact that my radiator isn't very upright, I may give that a look at to see if it can be put at nearer 90 degrees to the inlet through the nose cone, I have made sure that all of the fins are straight and flow ok, is there any benefit to block up the gaps between the side of the rad and the nose cone sides, also at the top?

I'll try and strip the oil pump off this week and see how it goes.

Jason

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obfripper

posted on 7/3/21 at 02:59 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Deckman001
One thought i do have though is the fact that my radiator isn't very upright, I may give that a look at to see if it can be put at nearer 90 degrees to the inlet through the nose cone, I have made sure that all of the fins are straight and flow ok, is there any benefit to block up the gaps between the side of the rad and the nose cone sides, also at the top.




This was a problem with my striker when i had the original crossflow radiator, blocking the outside of radiator to nosecone made the electric cooling fan far more effective, i have a polo/golf rad nowdays which doesn't seem to need it, but probably would be more effective with one.


Dave

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Deckman001

posted on 7/3/21 at 03:53 PM Reply With Quote



This was a problem with my striker when i had the original crossflow radiator, blocking the outside of radiator to nosecone made the electric cooling fan far more effective, i have a polo/golf rad nowdays which doesn't seem to need it, but probably would be more effective with one.


Dave


Cheers, I'll try and see if I have any foam insulation spare that might fit the bill

Jason

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David Jenkins

posted on 7/3/21 at 04:44 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by rusty nuts
Oil pressure relief valve can cause problems by sticking,which can affect pressure they can be cleaned .


I had exactly the same symptoms on my xflow when I was going to the SVA - if you take the oil pump off you will see a shiny circle, which is the top of the oil pressure relief piston. It should be at the bottom of its travel - in my case, some dirt in the oil had made it stick at the top of its travel. A gentle push with a non-scratch tool (i.e. a clean wooden stick) and it clicked back into place. Never caused me any trouble since.

It's an easy thing to check - either you can fix it once you've taken the pump off, or you can exclude it from your list of possibilities.





The older I get, the better I was...

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Deckman001

posted on 7/3/21 at 08:21 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by David Jenkins
quote:
Originally posted by rusty nuts
Oil pressure relief valve can cause problems by sticking,which can affect pressure they can be cleaned .


I had exactly the same symptoms on my xflow when I was going to the SVA - if you take the oil pump off you will see a shiny circle, which is the top of the oil pressure relief piston. It should be at the bottom of its travel - in my case, some dirt in the oil had made it stick at the top of its travel. A gentle push with a non-scratch tool (i.e. a clean wooden stick) and it clicked back into place. Never caused me any trouble since.

It's an easy thing to check - either you can fix it once you've taken the pump off, or you can exclude it from your list of possibilities.


Cheers David, very much appreciated

Am going to give it a look at tomorrow afternoon hopefully.

Jason

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procomp

posted on 8/3/21 at 12:02 PM Reply With Quote
Hi, as mentioned pressure valve not seated.
If using a decent 20/50 mineral oil at start up from cold it should have enough pressure to blow relief valve usually 55 -70 Lb depending on spring fitted.
When up to running temp, water 85Deg the pressure will be 20-30 Lb Edit to add at tickover.

[Edited on 8/3/21 by procomp]

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Deckman001

posted on 9/3/21 at 01:22 PM Reply With Quote
Many many thanks to everyone, to cut a long story short, I think I've sorted the issue.

I checked everything i thought might be issues yesterday afternoon, and found the electrical attachment to the sender loose

Totally my fault as I put together the engine quickly on a couple of visits to the MOT station where my car was up on a ramp.

I can confirm that once tightened and turned over, the gauge showed 40-50psi straight away, and when left to fully warm up and when the fan kicked in it still showed 40psi, slightly flicking up and down a little, but I think i am very happy with that result

Am confident that all of your replies though will help anyone who is in a similar position with engine oil issues, What a resource this site is !!

Jason

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simon04

posted on 17/3/21 at 07:43 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Deckman001



This was a problem with my striker when i had the original crossflow radiator, blocking the outside of radiator to nosecone made the electric cooling fan far more effective, i have a polo/golf rad nowdays which doesn't seem to need it, but probably would be more effective with one.


Dave


Cheers, I'll try and see if I have any foam insulation spare that might fit the bill

Jason

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simon04

posted on 17/3/21 at 07:46 PM Reply With Quote
Interesting to read that you were running a xflow in your striker and needed to flow the air from nose cone to rad.
I had to do the same when i build mine 15 yrs ago.
The polo rad left loads of room around it so i put some .5mm ally sheet down both sides of the rad and the top of it to block off the gap and force all the air through the rad.
It did help

Ive now converted to a zetec but without the infil panels which i think will need to go back in

Cheers

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GaryM

posted on 18/3/21 at 10:02 PM Reply With Quote
Now Iím a bit worried......

My 1600 xflow is also recently rebuilt after being bored out to the 2nd overbore. Crank grind, new shells and big ends, new pistons and rings. New valves and guides and head and deck skimmed. My oil pump only has 1200 miles on it and the engine is full of Valvoline vR1 20/50.

When cold my oil pressure gauge (non electronic) reads 40 psi but when the engine is very hot 90-100 degrees this can drop to just under 10 psi at idle. Adding revs sees the oil pressure climb to above 20 psi.

Should I be looking for a problem too?

[Edited on 18/3/21 by GaryM]

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simon04

posted on 18/3/21 at 10:24 PM Reply With Quote
Hi
Ok i ran my xflow for 15 yrs with little or no issues
it had a hot cam an twin webber 40s
i ran it in my striker with a polo rad
i had a burton hi pressure oil pump on it and never had an issue with pressures.
I have had this thought though.

I did one oil change early on and used a modern synthetic oil
It did not like it

When i spoke to some people about it they suggested that even though it was rebored and everything was new they were designed with a lot more free tolerance and were designed on older engine oil types
i ran mine on castrol gtx and never had in issue from that point
Just a thought.

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rusty nuts

posted on 19/3/21 at 07:58 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by GaryM
Now Iím a bit worried......

My 1600 xflow is also recently rebuilt after being bored out to the 2nd overbore. Crank grind, new shells and big ends, new pistons and rings. New valves and guides and head and deck skimmed. My oil pump only has 1200 miles on it and the engine is full of Valvoline vR1 20/50.

When cold my oil pressure gauge (non electronic) reads 40 psi but when the engine is very hot 90-100 degrees this can drop to just under 10 psi at idle. Adding revs sees the oil pressure climb to above 20 psi.

Should I be looking for a problem too?

[Edited on 18/3/21 by GaryM]




I think I would try to reduce the engine temperature a bit by making sure all air entering the nose is going through the rad and perhaps venting the bonnet to allow hot air to escape. Water wetter will drop the coolant temperature as well. I had running problems in traffic on hot days due to fuel vaporising which was cured by reducing under bonnet temperature

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