Dougie T
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| posted on 5/2/08 at 05:35 PM |
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Front lower ball joint
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Does any one know if the front lower ball joint(maxi) could be changed for another bolt on item that does not require the uprights to be reamed, e.g a
cortina bolt on item or some such thing, P.s I am planning to use xr4x4 front uprights that can apparently be modified for use(which I would also like
more info on.)
Any help would be most welcome.(haynes roadster build)
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mistergrumpy
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| posted on 5/2/08 at 05:36 PM |
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I think if you do a sarch and don't quote me but one of the Alfa's ball joint has the correct taper. I'm guessing but maybe a 156
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02GF74
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| posted on 5/2/08 at 05:46 PM |
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apparenlty there are two tapers; something like 1 in 6 and 1 in 8 .... but, and I know this as I spent many a minute looking torugh the catalogue, the
major/minor diameters vary between manufacturers so these have to match your hole.
too small then it will never grip, too big and you may not have enough interference fit.
you can buy reamers - was discussed here a couple days back so a search will reveal all.
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James
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| posted on 5/2/08 at 05:48 PM |
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Having gone down the 'make life awkward' route of doing things non-standard (with most of my build  ) I highly recommend keeping things
straightforward!
You'll regret not doing so in the long run! 
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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Mole
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| posted on 5/2/08 at 08:53 PM |
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Mark 2 Astra fits
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Dougie T
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| posted on 5/2/08 at 09:04 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Mole
Mark 2 Astra fits
Do they fit with the 4x4 front uprights?
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indykid
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| posted on 5/2/08 at 09:48 PM |
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cortina uprights fit the maxi balljoint.......changing to them's probably as much trouble as you're asking for using different ball
joints.
remember not all balljoints are designed to work in the same way as the maxi, despite them having the same taper.
tom
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MikeRJ
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| posted on 6/2/08 at 11:50 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Mole
Mark 2 Astra fits
But aren't designed to be loaded with the ball being "pulled out" of the joint.
Dougie, are you asking for a bolt in replacement for the maxi ball joints, i.e. one that would fit directly into a wishbone designed for the maxi
balljoint? If so then no such beast exists, otherwise everyone would be using them!
If not, then I guess you are making your own wishbones from scratch?
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bob
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| posted on 6/2/08 at 01:08 PM |
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Alfa 164
Heres a link to the alfa 164 botom BJ
Alfa 164 BJ link
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Mole
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| posted on 6/2/08 at 01:44 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by Mole
Mark 2 Astra fits
But aren't designed to be loaded with the ball being "pulled out" of the joint.
Hijacking a bit I know but I'm not sure what you mean. I was about to use these are they really a bad idea? Is the Alfa 164 a better prospect?
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Dougie T
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| posted on 6/2/08 at 10:22 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by Mole
Mark 2 Astra fits
But aren't designed to be loaded with the ball being "pulled out" of the joint.
Dougie, are you asking for a bolt in replacement for the maxi ball joints, i.e. one that would fit directly into a wishbone designed for the maxi
balljoint? If so then no such beast exists, otherwise everyone would be using them!
If not, then I guess you are making your own wishbones from scratch?
Yes as it seems I will be building them from scratch possibly with a cut
and shut of the sierra bottom arm and BJ as in ewans and liams 4x4 conversions.
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MikeRJ
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| posted on 7/2/08 at 06:37 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Mole
Hijacking a bit I know but I'm not sure what you mean. I was about to use these are they really a bad idea? Is the Alfa 164 a better prospect?
The lower ball joints used on a McPherson strut system only have to provide lateral location (from cornering and braking/accelertation forces), and
any pull out/push in forces exerted by an anti-roll bar if fitted. The bottom balljoint on a Locost with book type suspension takes the entire weight
of that corner of the vehicle, and the forces are such that the ball is always being pulled "out" of it's joint.
Another issue is that suitable ball joints tend to have fixing points located around the actual ball joint itself (e.g. Cortina/Maxi), but the Astra
ones (IIRC) have a fixing holes some distance away from the ball joint on a metal "leg" that is part of the ball joint body. Use in a
Locost type suspension will impose fairly significant bending forces on this "leg".
The bottom line is that the Astra balljoints may be up the job, or they might fail catastrophically at a very inconvenient moment. I'd
certainly want to know conclusively before designing them in.
Sorry, I don't have a clue what the Alfa ball joint looks like, so I can't comment on it's suitability.
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Dougie T
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| posted on 8/2/08 at 01:05 PM |
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I was wondering if the alfa 3.0l alfa 164 ball joint fits the 4x4 upright.
It is supposed to be too big for the 2wd versions(although the 2.0l twinspark one fits) but it may fit xr4x4's...just a thought.
Apparently the xr4x4 has the same taper as the 2wd versions of 1 in 6 but is a bigger hole.
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Dougie T
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| posted on 8/2/08 at 01:07 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by Mole
Hijacking a bit I know but I'm not sure what you mean. I was about to use these are they really a bad idea? Is the Alfa 164 a better prospect?
The lower ball joints used on a McPherson strut system only have to provide lateral location (from cornering and braking/accelertation forces), and
any pull out/push in forces exerted by an anti-roll bar if fitted. The bottom balljoint on a Locost with book type suspension takes the entire weight
of that corner of the vehicle, and the forces are such that the ball is always being pulled "out" of it's joint.
Another issue is that suitable ball joints tend to have fixing points located around the actual ball joint itself (e.g. Cortina/Maxi), but the Astra
ones (IIRC) have a fixing holes some distance away from the ball joint on a metal "leg" that is part of the ball joint body. Use in a
Locost type suspension will impose fairly significant bending forces on this "leg".
The bottom line is that the Astra balljoints may be up the job, or they might fail catastrophically at a very inconvenient moment. I'd
certainly want to know conclusively before designing them in.
Sorry, I don't have a clue what the Alfa ball joint looks like, so I can't comment on it's suitability.
People have used the
Astra ball joint before and Unless they killed themselves when they failed I have yet to hear of someone removing them because they were unsuitable.
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britishtrident
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| posted on 8/2/08 at 03:51 PM |
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ISTRC MK used the Astra ball joint for a while and then went over to Maxi --- which also isn't designed for pullout loads but has enough safety
margin to work on a light car.
(Max suspension is like the Mini only bigger the hydroelastic displacer worked on the top wishbone).
Fiat 124 ball joint (Lada ? Polski 125P ?) has also been used.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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