Liam
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 04:18 PM |
|
|
Aargghh! Just bought me first house! Advice appreciated...
Hellooo...
Me and my partner have just bought our first house (well going through the process as we speak)!! It was all a bit sudden to be honest - was really
supposed to be 'looking at houses rehearsal' but we bought the first house we saw cos it's got such great potential (we think)!
Part of the reason we could actually afford to do so, and at the same time get something that is quite spacious and suits our needs, is because it is
a bit of a project!! It's a 30's semi bungalow just vacated by an elderly couple which clearly hasn't had much work done on it
since the 70's (apart from a recent new roof which is handy!).
The situation we're in is that we can stay where we currently live for the time being (parents!) and make the house habitable in our own time
and as finances allow. Major jobs are destruction of the uselessly small kitchen and bathroom and extending them using some 'spare' dead
space in some strangely planned old extensions. Got an old back boiler to replace and one floor length window on an external wall will need to be
swapped for a conventional height but wider one. After that it's just modernisation of the decor etc etc.
We want to do as much ourselves as possible. I'm a professional engineer and have worked in construction for a few years too labouring whilst i
was bumming around after graduating. I've no formal trade qualifications but I'm pretty competent practically and have done a fair bit of
work on my parent's property - minor plastering, kitchen floor tiling, carpentry, decoration etc etc. I'm not scared to have a go at
anything but will need to read up a lot and seek advice!
My real questions at the moment are as follows:
1. Generally, what exactly are you allowed to do diy nowadays anyway? From brief research on here and elsewhere it would seem that electrical work
is a no-no with all this type-p cert stuff (dispite my electrical engineering degree). Plumbing may be a possibility - i'm certainly not scared
of trying it as i work as a mechanical engineer at a fluid engineering research place and piping, pressure/leak testing etc etc is a daily thing - but
am i allowed to do it in my own house? Gas is one area i'm not confident in and would want to call on a professional. Building work - removing
walls and building new ones etc etc should be OK. Any general advice appreciated!
2. We should complete in a few weeks time. I'm currently 3D modelling the whole house from measurements and 'virtually'
implementing our evil plans for wall rearrangement. But i'm itching to get in there and start 'investigating' internal walls with a
hammer and removing 70's fixtures with extreme prejudice! But what do I have to do to stay on the right side of regs? Do I need to inform
building control of our plans before i start smashing too much stuff out? Again any advice appreciated.
3. Any good sparkys, plumbers etc here in the Bedford area who wont take me for a ride when it comes to calling on the pros?
Many thanks for your time, folks. I'll post a piccy or two of the major offending pieces of 70's decor that will be first to meet the
sledgehammer 
Liam
|
|
|
|
|
b184
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 04:26 PM |
|
|
Dose it have a garage for your project
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 04:31 PM |
|
|
You can do your own electrics if you are familiar with the regs enough to satisfy a building inspector. Just pay the fee to sumbit a building notice.
The council then has to arrange testing and certification (assuming it passes!). If you are already doing major work, ie an extention, just add it
onto that notice at no extra cost.
|
|
|
Liam
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 04:37 PM |
|
|
Ah right - i read you were investigating this kind of thing in a previous thread. Did you end up sitting the exams to get the letters and bits of
paper (it was you who was considering that wasn't it)?
So this 'building notice', then? Is that what i have to do to before i can really start smashing anything up? "Hello building
control, i want to knock down this wall and build a new one here etc etc..."
Cheers,
Liam
P.S. Yes it has a good sized garage for the project . Was my main house buyinh criteria and pretty impossible to find for our budget so i'm
happy. Looks like the car will be delayed even longer though 
quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
You can do your own electrics if you are familiar with the regs enough to satisfy a building inspector. Just pay the fee to sumbit a building notice.
The council then has to arrange testing and certification (assuming it passes!). If you are already doing major work, ie an extention, just add it
onto that notice at no extra cost.
|
|
|
Peteff
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 04:52 PM |
|
|
Any general advice appreciated!
Don't knock anything down that holds something up Live in it as it is for a while till you decide what to do to make it how you want it.
Knocking a house about is a good way to annoy neighbours joined onto it, another good way is to light fires or rattle the dustbins a lot
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
|
|
|
eznfrank
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 05:10 PM |
|
|
I have done three houses now, not so much to make £ but more to move up the property ladder and bring down the o/s on my mortgage. When I started I
knew zip (although my dad's a builder) and I've kind of taught myself.
In terms of plumbing, don't touch anything gas related, although don't be afraid of doing the central heating etc, just don't
connect it to the gas that's all. Although it is a bit more expensive I always use Polyplumb, if you can do Lego you can re-plumb a house with
poly, it really is just push fit. There's no legal issues relating to plumbing that I'm aware of.
In terms of electrics I usually just replace existing and I'm comfortable with that but you do have to be careful doing much more.
Removing walls - stud walls yes that should be fine as long as they have no support function - sounds daft but I have seen stud walls supporting
floors above!! Re-building them again should be no issue.
In terms of the position of the walls there are some standard clearances you have to adhere to particularly in bathrooms that building regs man could
get funny about.
|
|
|
adam1985
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 05:23 PM |
|
|
didnt think you could do anything on electics anymore they have made it like corgi with gas
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 05:31 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by adam1985
didnt think you could do anything on electics anymore they have made it like corgi with gas
a common misconception/what they might want you to think!
You also dont have to be corgi registered to do gas work 
|
|
|
adam1985
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 05:37 PM |
|
|
why dont you have to be corgi registered
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 05:44 PM |
|
|
You only need to be corgi registered if you are issuing an invoice, ie working for the public. If doing it 'not for gain' (genuinely, for
yourself) then you only need be competent. Crucially, competence isnt defined, though gas men would tell you it means qualified with the right
elements. Its open to interpretation, but you would not get prosecuted for diy gas work if it was safe (ie designed right and tested).
Regarding electric work, only notifyable work must go through building control. This changed at some point but there was a list of works and locations
that needed notifying. Being registered with a competant person scheme (ie niceic, elecsa etc) means you can self certify.
|
|
|
adam1985
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 06:04 PM |
|
|
so if i was to do some work on my gas supply how would i prove i was competant without the relivant qualifications
|
|
|
spaximus
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 06:07 PM |
|
|
If it is your first house I would suggest getting a survey on it. A 30s bungalow may well have lots of rotten joists etc under the floor that you may
well not see.
Work wise you can do it all youself but everything like the gas and Electrics need to be signed off, if you don't selling the house in the
future may well be a problem.
Look at insulation as if it has any problems in that department you can cavity fill the walls before decorating.
Don't knock walls down before checking they aren't load bearing and as others have suggested be sure they layout works before spending
cash.
Take time and do it right first time and congratulations, not many better feelings than your first home together.
|
|
|
phil.shelton
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 06:13 PM |
|
|
Find a electricain woh will sign off installation he will want abot 100 - 150 for a test and certificate. most electricans would rather do a few tests
and fill out a bit of paper than actualy chase walls out and run cables.
|
|
|
garage19
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 06:19 PM |
|
|
You can do you own electrics.
As said prevviously you do however need someone part p qualified to come in and inspect and test afterwards. Cost of this is ussually iro £80 round my
way.
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 06:22 PM |
|
|
this one comes up often on another forum i frequent - it is allegedly not legal for a spark to sign off someone elses work. The certificate you sign
says 'responsible for the design, construction, inspection and testing ', which you clearly are not if you come in at the end to sign it
off. I certainly wouldnt touch someone elses work with a barge pole.
Regarding the issue of competent gas work, the proof is in the pudding. If it doesnt kill anyone, you were likely competent.
|
|
|
adam1985
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 06:29 PM |
|
|
or very lucky (more likely)
|
|
|
DIY Si
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 06:45 PM |
|
|
As long as you can solder properly, I don't see why it should be a problem. Well, that and get the flue right so you don't poison
everyone.
|
|
|
gazza285
|
| posted on 25/5/08 at 10:13 PM |
|
|
Buy some red and black cable from eBay and wire it yourself, then learn to say "It was like that when I moved in".
DO NOT PUT ON KNOB OR BOLLOCKS!
|
|
|
Guinness
|
| posted on 26/5/08 at 08:46 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by gazza285
Buy some red and black cable from eBay and wire it yourself, then learn to say "It was like that when I moved in".
Liam, if you are extending the property there will be a limit to what you can do before you have to submit a planning application. This is called
"permitted development". Typically this includes replacement of a roof, replacement of windows (i.e. old for new upvc etc), small
extensions, conservatories and porches etc. Beyond that you'll have to produce a set of plans and submit a planning application.
See here for more details:
http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/planningandbuilding/planningguidehouseholders
This format is largely followed by Building Control. Most DIY stuff isn't notifiable, kitchen replacement, new bathroom suite, new decoration,
finishes etc Bigger stuff then falls into two groups, "Full Plans Submission" and "Building Notice".
The original idea was that you submitted a full set of plans for a new building or major project in advance of the start on site, the Building Control
dept looked over the plans, approved them, then you started on site. Trouble was it took months to get approval. So people started using the
Building Notice route to notify the council of even major projects! Previously building notices had been used as a polite nod to the council that you
were knocking down a wall, and if they wanted to come along and have a look or pass comment they could.
Best bet is to talk to the council before starting work, tell them or show them your plans for which walls you are planning on removing etc, and
they'll advise you accordingly on which route to take.
http://www.luton.gov.uk/internet/Environment/Planning/Building%20control
Bear in mind that you'd be best off getting a structural engineer to spec the beams for you if any of the walls are supporting walls (i.e. not
stud). Otherwise it could quite literally be on your head!
Also worth considering that the local council doesn't have a monopoly on Building Control anymore. There are "approved inspectors"
who work either for themselves or large companies. These guys are often a better bet for the following reasons:
They are a business so they want their side of things done with minimum of delay so they can get paid!
They often have a more reasonable view of what is acceptable. As you are working on an existing building it is never going to comply to all the new
regs. Any work you do should attempt to improve the situation, but certainly not make anything worse.
Finally they are often in competition with other firms, so the fees can be lower than the councils. Worth shopping around if you do need full plans
submission.
If you want any help with the paperwork side of things, let me know!
Cheers
Mike
|
|
|
Liam
|
| posted on 27/5/08 at 08:54 PM |
|
|
Awesome thanks for all the responses guys! I'm a little clearer with the exact path to follow now I think. Homebuyers detailed survey is being
done nowish so we're waiting on the results of that. Assuming it's valued ok and isn't found to be about to fall down then
it's all systems go.
So the first thing to do is put in a building notice, right? I still need to clarify what exactly needs to go on that (looks like electrical and
window replacement for sure, what about internal wall moving, and can't see anything regarding plumbing). Even with the guide to the fees
payable i'm having trouble working out what it will cost - lol! Might have to actually go and see mr building control.
Anyway thanks for the help so far...
Liam
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 27/5/08 at 09:36 PM |
|
|
ive never heard of anyone submitting notice regarding removing an internal wall. Water plumbing certainly isnt regulated.
|
|
|
Liam
|
| posted on 27/5/08 at 09:59 PM |
|
|
Ah right that's cool - so maybe the only things i'm doing that are notifiable are the electrical work and the one window replacement.
Plumbing do myself and call on a pro for the gas connection.
I'm looking at Beds Borough Council's Website and I
understand other authorities have similar (but subtly different) forms and pricing schemes. Looks like i'll have to pay at least the 200 quid
for electrical work building notification and 140 for domestic windows work. Hopefully that's it. What about the regularisation charges?
Seems like that's something to do with unauthorised work (whatever that is - perhaps anything i get on with before my application is approved?).
Hmmmm...
Cheers,
LIam
|
|
|
mad4x4
|
| posted on 28/5/08 at 11:34 AM |
|
|
When I had my windows replaced about 5 years ago we never submitted a Building warrent. the company came in ripped out the windows and put in new
ones.
I thought building warrents were for new builds, etxtensions, garages, etc. i.e major work
Scot's do it better in Kilts.
MK INDY's Don't Self Centre Regardless of MK Setting !
|
|
|
DarrenW
|
| posted on 28/5/08 at 01:36 PM |
|
|
This might sound stupid advice. Do not spend any more than is absolutely necessary.
Spend time seriously thinking about every spend. If you fancy extending, think why. If its absolutely necessary then do it. If its just cos it would
be nice to do then dont. Always consider what every penny spent will do to the value.
i extended a 4 bed house a while ago and built a large 13' x 30' garage. 3 years and 2 kids later i realised i was only using 60% of the
space in the house effectively. Extension was a waste. Garage was nice, but again i just filled it with junk i didnt need. Even to build the car i
didnt need one that big.
I spent a fortune refitting kitchen and fitting range cooker. I could have had same effect and spent 2 grand less.
Same in bathroom. Had to have best mains powered shower and even fitted new boiler to feed it. Total overkill. The whirlpool bath rarely got used.
Now i treat each house as a development and spend absolute minimum whilst achieving a good look for the target buyers that would buy it if i had to
sell. Its not about how much you spend - its more about how well you finish it all off. Good quality finish often takes time rather than money within
reason.
|
|
|
DarrenW
|
| posted on 28/5/08 at 01:46 PM |
|
|
Some people are screwing better deals just before completion. I dont like that approach whe buying someones home but worth bearing in mind. If you are
first time buyer then you are in strong position.
Remember - you make your money when you buy - not when you sell.
Non-supporting walls shouldnt be an issue to remove.
Ive had some windows and doors fitted recently and just didnt say they were new on propoerty details. I was told recently that FENSA was more about
controlling who is fitting them so tax man can get his cut rather than for gree and insulation issues. I guess there is nothing wrong with saying you
fitted them yourself and getting local authority to issue certificate.
Gas and electric work is pretty sewn up now. Ive replaced fittings and put spurs into non zoned rooms myself but you need to watch the regs. I was
told surveyors have been known to lift sockets off walls in kitchens and if new wires are seen then ask for certificates. Apparaently the old coloured
wiring fetches a premium these days.
Most councils seem to be very approachable these days for advice.
It is so easy on your first house to get carried away with all of the stuff that is on offer. i always think what do people expect to see in a house
in this area and at this price range. No point fitting home automation in a 100 grand terraced house.
Bargain hard on everything you buy. Ive had 14% knocked off a kitchen in a 50% plus 20& sale at MFI before by doing homework. I later found a
trade place doing the same ranges cheaper still.
|
|
|
