At 2 different sprints this year.there were cars roll over.Teeside and Anglesey! Wasn't nice to see when one was an open top car with an elderly
driver!
Motorsport is dangerous and, with all due respect to some people, they should not be allowed on track without some tuition
I have seen it all to often where people try to drive at 10/10ths and also hearing people talk at the track - ignoring the typical bravado, some
comments are plain scary.
ie people talking about "going flat out" to chase/race/catch someone - it is plain stupid because they dont realise that if they are
driving that hard then they have no contingency to get out of trouble which you must have on a trackday because of the different machinery and
abilities out there.
We have probably all experienced the "person" who overtakes us going into a corner because they think we are driving too slow or just
because "they can" but what they probably dont realise the level of risk they expose us both to.
During a typical trackday briefing, you are repeatedly told to drive within yourself and be aware of your surrounds, unfortunately it would appear
that some people somehow hear this as "Welcome to the Trackday Grand Prix, Drivers start your engines..."
Just my $0.02 worth of perspective.
"If I knew what I was doing then it wouldn't be called research would it?...duh!"
quote:Originally posted by onenastyviper
they should not be allowed on track without some tuition
I agree. After all, we're not allowed on the road without tuition, so why shouldn't there be some restriction on who can go on a track?
Even actual racing requires a 'provisional' period, so why shouldn't trackdays.
Having said that, even with the best tuition, when you're first let loose on your own there will be an element of 'wannabe racing
driver' there.
Personally I'm confident that I would turn into Miss Daisy's chauffeur on my first track day in my own car, but it's still worrying
to see how many innocent drivers get taken out by others.
I take it kit car trackdays are a little less likely to end in trouble?
quote:Originally posted by onenastyviper
they should not be allowed on track without some tuition
I agree. After all, we're not allowed on the road without tuition, so why shouldn't there be some restriction on who can go on a track?
Even actual racing requires a 'provisional' period, so why shouldn't trackdays.
Having said that, even with the best tuition, when you're first let loose on your own there will be an element of 'wannabe racing
driver' there.
Personally I'm confident that I would turn into Miss Daisy's chauffeur on my first track day in my own car, but it's still worrying
to see how many innocent drivers get taken out by others.
I take it kit car trackdays are a little less likely to end in trouble?
I am not sure anyone can comment as to the likelyhood of trouble at any trackday, afterall you could do all the right things but still end up involved
in someones accident.
As for the Miss Daisy comment, I have seen confident drivers get in a muddle on a track - even after being warned it is not like driving on a road:
things happen much faster on the track and I think this is what people forget.
"If I knew what I was doing then it wouldn't be called research would it?...duh!"
There are hundreds of trackdays each year with thousands of people doing them. It is rare for someone to be collected in someone else's
accident. There are always incidents when people are on the wrong line/too fast for the conditions/run out of talent but they typically end up with
minor damage and dented pride. Occasionally you have people like this
But generally things are OK. Watch out for old racecars as they tend to be driven hard and, as a general rule, the more the Track Day costs the less
'incidents' there tends to be.
In my experience on track it's the slow drivers that cause issues, they don't use there mirrors often enough to realise how fast the fast
drivers are gaining on them, and constantly cut you up and take to the racing lines way to early approaching bends
I agree about compulsory tuition for first timers, an instructor would be able to tell if most people are ready within 1 or 2 laps, and if not further
instruction should be taken.
But I think it should be more about the track etiquette, that's what needs patrolling. Maybe track 'police cars', organisers taking
occasional laps in unmarked tuition cars to see how drivers are behaving to other users.
However I don't think people should be expected to take it easy, going flat out (to some,) is the whole idea of a track day. Going 'flat
out' isn't a dirty word, there are races every weekend with thousands of people going flat out in much more dangerous (competive)
environments, and (serious) accidents are few and far between.
IMO, going flat out is something you can do when you have carefully built to wards the limits of the driver and the car - and a trackday is the safest
possible environment to do that. Of course there are some who spoil it, and jump past their limits rather than building towards them, then don't
learn (or cant learn).
Anyone who partakes in a TD should be aware of the risks, and cover themselves or their car should they deem it necessary.
Photo Archive
Building: Built - Fury '06R1 ...now on with the mods
posted on 1/12/14 at 01:32 PM
quote:Originally posted by CosKev3
In my experience on track it's the slow drivers that cause issues, they don't use there mirrors often enough to realise how fast the fast
drivers are gaining on them, and constantly cut you up and take to the racing lines way to early approaching bends
As the vast majority of track days are run on an "overtaking on the staights and with permission" basis (I know of only one company who
don't do this) then they can't be cutting you up or taking the racing line in any way thats dangerous to you... unless you're
breaking the overtake rules.
quote:Originally posted by loggyboy
I agree about compulsory tuition for first timers, an instructor would be able to tell if most people are ready within 1 or 2 laps, and if not further
instruction should be taken.
But I think it should be more about the track etiquette, that's what needs patrolling. Maybe track 'police cars', organisers taking
occasional laps in unmarked tuition cars to see how drivers are behaving to other users.
However I don't think people should be expected to take it easy, going flat out (to some,) is the whole idea of a track day. Going 'flat
out' isn't a dirty word, there are races every weekend with thousands of people going flat out in much more dangerous (competive)
environments, and (serious) accidents are few and far between.
IMO, going flat out is something you can do when you have carefully built to wards the limits of the driver and the car - and a trackday is the safest
possible environment to do that. Of course there are some who spoil it, and jump past their limits rather than building towards them, then don't
learn (or cant learn).
Anyone who partakes in a TD should be aware of the risks, and cover themselves or their car should they deem it necessary.
Sorry, I understand your point but I think you are wrong with regards to the "flat out" because if you want to go flat out, get a license
and do a test day with other machinery also going flat out. Trackdays are meant to be a bit of fun, I am not saying take it easy but I would recommend
driving well within your limits.
"If I knew what I was doing then it wouldn't be called research would it?...duh!"
Ive had a few moments on track where you are following behind someone on a bend preparing yourself to overtake when the road straightens up, then the
person in front gets all out of control, and starts snaking around. A lot of the time they dont realise there are people behind them, and by the time
they have finished snaking around you are on the next bend meaning you are stuck behind them for a while. Ive noticed it happen more on Blyton Park as
it is quite a small track with lots of bends.
Even when you are following people in capable cars going round the circuit well you need to be on guard for if someone in fron loses control
Here is one of my Vids from Blyton. I catch up with 2x other 7 drivers, then out of nowhere the guy in front spins off at 1:35. Luckily the guy
behind him was in a position to swerve around
quote:Originally posted by onenastyviper
Sorry, I understand your point but I think you are wrong with regards to the "flat out" because if you want to go flat out, get a license
and do a test day with other machinery also going flat out. Trackdays are meant to be a bit of fun, I am not saying take it easy but I would recommend
driving well within your limits.
I drive on the road 'well within my limits' (most of the time - lol), why on earth would I want to pay extra to do that?!
Maybe (without meaning to sound conceited) because I can drive close to the limit without crashing i'm bias.
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Building: Sold turboblade, back to tin tops
posted on 1/12/14 at 05:47 PM
I like to drive near or at my limits on a track day, this does not mean I am dangerous to others as I follow the etiquette and stay behind until waved
by and like to throw my car into bends.
I have seen the gravel and grass a few times and spun, the only time I hit the Armco hard was when I went out after someone had been spilling fuel all
over the track, they had overfilled, came out the bend, hit the loud pedal and promptly span off, three other cars did the same thing on different
places on the track, cost me a steering rack and the day.
I have also been hit from behind, Cadwell when I started the third session cold slicks so was not up to speed but holding my line coming out a bend,
the tosser behind expected me to move over, this was just before a long straight and he was a racer using the track day as a warm up for racing the
next day..... The stewards told him off.
I would not take my DB7 on a track day where many cars are running, I do sprint it as then it's all my fault if it goes wrong.
quote:Originally posted by CosKev3
In my experience on track it's the slow drivers that cause issues, they don't use there mirrors often enough to realise how fast the fast
drivers are gaining on them, and constantly cut you up and take to the racing lines way to early approaching bends
As the vast majority of track days are run on an "overtaking on the staights and with permission" basis (I know of only one company who
don't do this) then they can't be cutting you up or taking the racing line in any way thats dangerous to you... unless you're
breaking the overtake rules.
Lol!
So your telling me EVERY car you have overtaken on track has gave you permission?
Bullshit I'm afraid.
If you waited for permission off some of the useless drivers on track days before over taking you would be following them for lap after lap.
Photo Archive
Building: confidence and miles with smiles
posted on 1/12/14 at 11:07 PM
I feel there are a couple of things missing in this conversation
1) The difference between OPL and grouped session days.
2) Like learning to drive on the road, everybody was new once on track.
What all people that drive on track do have in common is that they are enthusiasts. They are there to push themselves and their cars to their
perceived limit. Some people take it easy, some people dont but ALL want to go faster!
Track days ARE the best thing since sliced bread, until I get a supercharger that is!
quote:Originally posted by onenastyviper
Sorry, I understand your point but I think you are wrong with regards to the "flat out" because if you want to go flat out, get a license
and do a test day with other machinery also going flat out. Trackdays are meant to be a bit of fun, I am not saying take it easy but I would recommend
driving well within your limits.
I drive on the road 'well within my limits' (most of the time - lol), why on earth would I want to pay extra to do that?!
Maybe (without meaning to sound conceited) because I can drive close to the limit without crashing i'm bias.
Like the comment
At the end of the day, I suppose it boils down to responsibility - if you are going to "drive at the limit" what ever that limit may be,
just make sure that you don't take anyone else off and that includes not getting involved in someone elses accident.
As others have commented, we have all seen the person who we are following eventually loose it (for me it was an Mk2 MR2 who overtook me past Clay
Hill then proceeded to spin out at Druids but I left plenty of space so didn't hit him).
But, I would recommend anyone if they want to drive at 100% to participate in a proper test day, there are usually more flags and marshals present
which helps a lot and you can overtake (or be overtaken) wherever you like - that really focusses the mind.
"If I knew what I was doing then it wouldn't be called research would it?...duh!"
