britishtrident
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 posted on 2/1/11 at 03:33 PM |
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Nissan Leaf Range
What do you think the range of a Nissan Leaf is ?
From the US Federal EPA's L4 test cycle
Highway 55MPH with A/C on 70Miles
At least one person I know tells me that is way optimistic as soon as you turn the heater on the predicted range on the dashboard display drops to
below 50 miles --- it is like buying a Nissan Micra with a one gallon petrol tank.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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PSpirine
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 03:57 PM |
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Given they should start shipping fairly soon, I think we'll find out pretty quickly what the real world expectations are.. I'd imagine
it's somewhere in the region of 50 if you've got the heater on, but I personally think even that will be more than enough for the people
that will be buying the first ones - for use in London etc. Lack of charging points wouldn't be a problem either as they'll most likely
only need to charge them overnight at home.
Either way, it's 20 miles to work for me, and I sure as hell wouldn't mind one!
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David Jenkins
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 04:12 PM |
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My weekday driving is about 6 miles each way - an electric car would be perfect, but there's no way I could justify the ridiculously high
purchase price. Also, as batteries have a limited life, how much would a new battery pack cost in a few years time?
Also, how long will it be before the government find some way of taxing the electricity they use? It's only a matter of time, as they become
more popular.
It's still very hard to beat the petrol engine for useful life and convenience... shame it's running out.
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BenB
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 04:30 PM |
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The real world mileage will be much less when people are using the heaters for the simple reason that most will be used in cities where traffic is a
problem. And all the time the heater runs (whilst sat in traffic) the milegage will drop and drop and drop.... And they're blooming expensive
for basically a Micra.
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smart51
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 05:02 PM |
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I'd have one tomorrow at half the price. 13 miles each way to work is well within the electric car's range, even with all the gizmos
switched on. No problem. People without a drive might struggle though.
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DRC INDY 7
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 05:09 PM |
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50 mile range is more than enough for most people on a daily bases
there are always people who look for the negatives rather than the positives
like i said its a start and can only get better with time
[Edited on 1/2/2011 by DRC INDY 7]
https://www.facebook.com/groups/462610273778799/
Puddle Dodgers Club
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MikeR
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 05:21 PM |
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The gov already taxes electricity - they'll just raise the price when everyone has swapped over to electric cars.
As for the car - if someone gave me one i'd love it. Perfect for when i had my old job 8 miles away. Ideal now for our nipping round to the
mother in laws / sister in laws or round to my mates. Only issue would be drives to see my family a hundred miles away - but i've got a diesel
focus for that.
If someone asked me to pay for one ........... i'd get a petrol / diesel car instead.
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cliftyhanger
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 05:25 PM |
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Indeed, I think the idea will take some getting used to, but a short range electric car will suit a massive proportion of the population. The long
distance problem is easy to overcome too. In Brighton, and I suspect most other cities/towns, there are loads of car clubs where you hire a car by the
hour. A much better solution than owning one for the occasional long journey.
And best of all, this preserves petrol for those who need it most
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britishtrident
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 05:27 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by DRC INDY 7
50 mile range is more than enough for most people on a daily bases
there are always people who look for the negatives rather than the positives
like i said its a start and can only get better with time
[Edited on 1/2/2011 by DRC INDY 7]
The hydrogen economy is the way things are going to go either for use in fuel cells or in a combustion engine.
The thing is 50 mile range might be fine for planned driving to work , but what happens if you get home from work and get a phone message that your
gran/mum/aunt who lives 20 miles away and has been taken ill.
[Edited on 4/1/11 by britishtrident]
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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Jonte
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 05:31 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
The thing is 50 mile range might be fine for planned driving to work , but what happens if you get home from work and get a phone message that your
gran/mum/aunt who lives 20 miles away and has been taken ill.
You get in your Se7en and floor it 
Click it
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DRC INDY 7
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 06:18 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
quote:
Originally posted by DRC INDY 7
50 mile range is more than enough for most people on a daily bases
there are always people who look for the negatives rather than the positives
like i said its a start and can only get better with time
[Edited on 1/2/2011 by DRC INDY 7]
The thing is 50 mile range might be fine for planned driving to work , but what happens if you get home from work and get a phone message that your
gran/mum/aunt who lives 20 miles away and has been taken ill.
That must be another negative from you what if what if You stick with you're rover it may or may not make the journey
And if you look on the Nissan web site it says 100 mile with ac/heating switched off
https://www.facebook.com/groups/462610273778799/
Puddle Dodgers Club
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:{THC}:YosamiteSam
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 06:21 PM |
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batteries - you dont own the batteries - they will be in the price of the car but on 'loan' if they die - you get new ones. there
will be changing station installed soon where you can swap them in just 3 minutes all automatically.
cost - the price is high right now but once demand goes higher it should come down with market pressure - it usually does - remember when cd
players first came out? plus your not buying fuel, there is less moving parts to service, tax? lower insurance. money will be returned slowly
PSpirine - 'Given they should start shipping fairly soon' not yet we arent - the battery plant is still being built for it! we currently
have about 4 hand made cars for evaluation. the cars are already on sale in japan and are a hit big time. if it was me i would need a 2nd car tho -
distances are just too great.
the battery range will get better and better in the next few years watch this space.. already it has doubled from what it was a few years back.
heaters - normal engines get heat from a hot engine - electric cars hant got a hot engine - so how do you get heat? bet you cant guess???
its not the same size as a micra mind you - more focus size
there are lots of new problems with electric cars that people dont see - and that costs money to develop out. for example water sealing motors - its
not as easy as you think.. modern cars are tough - they HAVE to meet government and european and company regulations - every year it gets harder -
and im not talking about emissions - material selection for environmental conditions coupled with being able to recycle that same material - the cars
have to have a percentage recyclability. that is not easy
the companies are very aware of costs to the customer and are trying very hard to bring it down - when suppliers get greedy because thier own
overheads are high due to not being efficient it passes on to the customer somehere
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Humbug
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 06:32 PM |
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In addition to the above concerns about range/location of charging points/unplanned diversions from a limited route, I would like to know what the
environmental impact is comparing the whole life of the car with a normal Micra:
Metal, etc. production for the body (presumably similar for both)
Extraction/production of the materials for the batteries (on the leccy one)
Fuel (oil extraction and conversion into petrol vs use of fuel to produce electricity)
Recyclability vs scrapping of all parts (including batteries)
...
you get the picture.
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:{THC}:YosamiteSam
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 06:36 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Humbug
In addition to the above concerns about range/location of charging points/unplanned diversions from a limited route, I would like to know what the
environmental impact is comparing the whole life of the car with a normal Micra:
Metal, etc. production for the body (presumably similar for both)
Extraction/production of the materials for the batteries (on the leccy one)
Fuel (oil extraction and conversion into petrol vs use of fuel to produce electricity)
Recyclability vs scrapping of all parts (including batteries)
...
you get the picture.
no different to any other car - bag of!
the only true green car is one you keep - replace it it kills the earth - END OF.
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coozer
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 06:39 PM |
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I'd have one if they werent so dear, in fact I'd buy any car but to me they are all too expensive.
The battery's are loaned and as Terry says the plan is for service places that swap you for full charged batery setup.
I just wonder what hapens say in 7 years time when the warranty runs out and the car is on its second, oe more, owner.
Will Nissan uphold the warranty on the batteries?
Steve
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mangogrooveworkshop
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 07:33 PM |
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How can be they advertising this thing as the car of the year 2011?
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russbost
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 08:09 PM |
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Slightly OT, but how do they operate the heater? Unless the motor itself gets hot enough to generate sufficient heat for the cabin the only other way
I can see is to use a heater much like an electric fire at home, ie air blown over hot wires. So not only do you need to run a significant size fan,
but you need something around 1kw or more of electric power just for the heating element - surely this would crucify the batteries????
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JoelP
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 08:52 PM |
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if i remember the review in a car magazine i read last week, it would take 300,000 miles to break even over a golf 1.6 diesel. Not worth it for now,
but it will get better with time.
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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Ninehigh
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 10:48 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by :{THC}:YosamiteSam
batteries - you dont own the batteries - they will be in the price of the car but on 'loan' if they die - you get new ones. there
will be changing station installed soon where you can swap them in just 3 minutes all automatically.
Bingo that solves the common problem of range, but I still think that range needs to be a good 100 miles. These cars should be aiming to replace ALL
cars and tbh I shouldn't have to go to the "petrol station" twice just to visit my parents every weekend.
Also as a taxi driver I often did 100-150 miles a day (not including going home) and sometimes that's just one fare, there's coming back
too.
Not to besmirch them but there's still improvement needed before the become mainstream.
I saw something about them not heating the cab in the conventional way too, what happens is they use the heated window (like your back one) and seat
heaters.
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David Jenkins
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 10:55 PM |
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Maybe I'll just wait for the hydrogen fuel-cell cars... also electric, but won't rely on batteries (well, maybe not so big and not for
normal running).
But until then I'll keep buying and burning hydrocarbons. 
Not trying to be negative, as I'd love one of these. I just can't justify spending that kind of money on it.
[Edited on 2/1/11 by David Jenkins]
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Ninehigh
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 10:58 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by David Jenkins
Maybe I'll just wait for the hydrogen fuel-cell cars... also electric, but won't rely on batteries (well, maybe not so big and not for
normal running).
But until then I'll keep buying and burning hydrocarbons.
Not trying to be negative, as I'd love one of these. I just can't justify spending that kind of money on it.
[Edited on 2/1/11 by David Jenkins]
Don't hold your breath, I've been telling Honda for about 3 years that the UK is screaming for a car that doesn't cost £1.30 a litre
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:{THC}:YosamiteSam
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 11:00 PM |
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na. Now i dont really know the way it works as the cars are still top secretly stored. BUT i do know that the heat is generated from the brakes
somehow. The tech must be new as i cant see how unless its using a kers type theory. The batteries range will be better and better as technology
grinds on. They have told us officially they are aiming for 200 miles in a few years.
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Guinness
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 11:05 PM |
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The major problem with electric cars, IMHO, is that the electricity has to come from somewhere.
Years of nimbyism, green lobbying and anti nuke protests have seen power supplies in the UK and the national grid come close to breaking point. The
grid can only just supply the electricity we already use, without adding transport to the load.
It'll take years to build new power stations to cope with the increase in demand.
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RazMan
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 11:06 PM |
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I think that Jaguar have got the right idea - 2 tiny turbines acting like enormous battery chargers. If the power management is good, you can minimise
the size of the batteries and power the car's leccy motors direct from one turbine and have the other one charging the batteries - that solves
the heater problem too as jet engines produce a bit of heat don't they?
Cheers,
Raz
When thinking outside the box doesn't work any more, it's time to build a new box
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:{THC}:YosamiteSam
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| posted on 2/1/11 at 11:20 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mangogrooveworkshop
How can be they advertising this thing as the car of the year 2011?
Lol yea just seen the ad on tv. Jeez. We laughed when it was announced that it was in the last few cars. From what iv heard its a panel of journalists
that vote.. Hmmm how the hell? Who has given a backhander to who? Lol
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