Printable Version | Subscribe | Add to Favourites
<<  1    2  >>
New Topic New Poll New Reply
Author: Subject: The ultimate commuter
wildchild

posted on 11/4/06 at 11:39 AM Reply With Quote
The ultimate commuter

A bit of a challenge...

This is possibly off at a bit of a tangent for all the sports car fanatics on here, but I think it's in the spirit of 'locosting' and hopefully it will spark off a bit of discussion.

If you were given the target of designing and building the ultimate commuter vehicle, how would you go about it and what would it be like? What would your priorities be. What fuel would you use?

The ground rules:

- More than two wheels. Obviously the ultimate commuter vehicle is a Honda C90 or CG125, but there's always going to be some silly people who aren't prepared to get their bike licence.

- I'm talking about ultimate in the sense of cheapness to run (and build), not performance, although it would be interesting to see what minimum performance criteria people would put on it.

- I'm mainly thinking about commuting into and around a city, not super high mileage motorway commutes where the requirements are somewhat different.


Get debating!

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
craig1410

posted on 11/4/06 at 11:51 AM Reply With Quote
Interesting question...

I don't have time right now for a full answer but here are some thoughts in no particular order:

1. LPG fuel

2. Three wheels ideally for efficiency but may not be popular so perhaps four..

3. Efficient 4 stroke engine with enough power to reach, say, 50 MPH. Engine should switch off when no power is called for - perhaps using a freewheeling flywheel to restart the engine. Engine should be thoroughly silenced.

4. Perhaps use a CVT type transmission to keep the engine in best efficiency RPM band.

5. Two seats (Controls can be moved to either side)

6. Range should be 100 miles or more between refuelling.

Cheers,
Craig.

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
greggors84

posted on 11/4/06 at 11:54 AM Reply With Quote
Something with a bit more protection than a motorbike, i think thats what puts most people off them.

Also maybe hi lo gearboxes, just a lever to change the final drive ratio would be good, so that it would be nippy round town, but could be comfortably used for motorsway stretches if need be.





Chris

The Magnificent 7!

View User's Profile E-Mail User View All Posts By User U2U Member
Hammerhead

posted on 11/4/06 at 11:58 AM Reply With Quote
already designed the ultimate commuter vehicle. Called the Com-V (Groan!)

See pics. Rescued attachment com-v1.jpg
Rescued attachment com-v1.jpg

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
Hammerhead

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:00 PM Reply With Quote
another Rescued attachment com-v2.jpg
Rescued attachment com-v2.jpg

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
Hammerhead

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:01 PM Reply With Quote
and more Rescued attachment com-v3.jpg
Rescued attachment com-v3.jpg

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
Hammerhead

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:02 PM Reply With Quote
nearly there Rescued attachment com-v4.jpg
Rescued attachment com-v4.jpg

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
Hammerhead

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:03 PM Reply With Quote
done. Rescued attachment com-v5.jpg
Rescued attachment com-v5.jpg

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
Hammerhead

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:07 PM Reply With Quote
the above model was made by me as part of my degree in product design. Carbon fibre monocoque with an electric motor inside the monocoque. Aluminium folding mechanism.

Wait till you see the bodywork design for the Hammerhead!!

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
craig1410

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:09 PM Reply With Quote
Yeah it would need to be fully enclosed for weather protection, personal protection and aerodynamics if it was to appeal to the general public.
View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
mangogrooveworkshop

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:11 PM Reply With Quote
they have a car just like that.............its called the SMART but people are to stupid to see beyond the boastwhatsonmydrivewayinfrontofmybarrethouse.
to go with them.
I got a smart from work for a few days and I loved it....12 quid to fill it up and great for parking. Nipping thru the traffic in Edinburgh great fun. I will be replaceing the present mondeo with a smart next year.






View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
Hammerhead

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:11 PM Reply With Quote
yes but if its the ultimate commuter, you need to be able to take it on trains etc.
View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
pajsh

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:19 PM Reply With Quote
Got to be something like the old bubble car (in line not side by side) but updated in terms of design, strength and economy with something like a 1.0l turbo diesel engine you might be able to get a certain amount of performance when you want it with economy when you don't.

With cars half as wide you could fit twice as many in..

Much better than the governments plan of adding lanes and roads that don't even achieve status quo by the time they are finished.

[Edited on 11/4/06 by pajsh]





I used to be apathetic but now I just don't care.

View User's Profile E-Mail User View All Posts By User U2U Member
wildchild

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:20 PM Reply With Quote
I was thinking about the bodywork.

I don't think the aerodynamics factor is critical around town. Yeah it starts to kick in a bit more outside town but you'd have to be quite clever and probably compromise on quite a lot of other things to get a good aero shape. The main thing is you'd end up dripping the seating position down to the floor to reduce frontal area, which isn't ideal in a town car.

Full weather protection would probably be necessary for a mass market vehicle, as would heating, stereo, and all sorts of other nonsense that would add weight and cost fuel.

At least partial protection (frontal and overhead) would be enough for me in a self built vehicle.

Perhaps some sort of modular bodywork that could be stripped down for the summer?

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
wildchild

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:25 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mangogrooveworkshop
they have a car just like that.............its called the SMART


What I had in my head was basically a 'locost' smart, but probably considerably more basic - i don't think you need 80 odd mph for a start.

What sort of mpg were you getting from the smart? it's probably a good benchmark.

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
MikeRJ

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:32 PM Reply With Quote
At least you could improve on the Smarts gearbox quite easily, with e.g. a couple of pulleys and rubber band.
View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
craig1410

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:36 PM Reply With Quote
I agree, when I mentioned aerodynamics I was thinking more in terms of stability and a smooth shape (ie. enclosed cockpit) not high speed aerodynamics.
View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
wildchild

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:41 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by pajsh
Got to be something like the old bubble car (in line not side by side)
...

With cars half as wide you could fit twice as many in..




I like the idea of tandem seating. 90% of the time you'd probably be on your own anyway, and it does allow for a much narrower vehicle.

My concern however is that you couldn't actually make it that much narrower without compromising stability, especially if you were trying to maintain a reasonably high driving position. So maybe there's a point in favour of the smart approach - a bit narrower but a LOT shorter.

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
eddymcclements

posted on 11/4/06 at 12:57 PM Reply With Quote
What about some sort of egg-shaped passenger compartment made from GRP / CF / kevlar on a cheap, easy-to-make steel tube chassis. One of those 3-cyl turbo engines from a Japanese microcar (Cappucino / S-Car Go or similar) could provide motive power, rear-mounted and with a CVT transmission, and re-tuned to run on one of these part-alcohol, part-petrol mixes. The "egg" would be pointy-end first and the top half would be a polycarbonate moulding giving good all-round visibility. I'd rob bits off tiny Daihatsus and Suzukis to get lightweight wheels, brakes and so on.

Eddy

View User's Profile E-Mail User View All Posts By User U2U Member
JonBowden

posted on 11/4/06 at 01:12 PM Reply With Quote
I'm not sure that many people would want to drive a super economy car. I think it might be viewed as indicating lack of success.
If however it were given a more positive spin then it might work.
Thus I would suggest that it should be :
Cool
Sporty (as in good acceleration and fab, fun handling).
Adequately practical
Inexpensive to buy
Cheap to run.

Of all of these, I suspect that coolness would be the most important.





Jon

View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
JonBowden

posted on 11/4/06 at 01:17 PM Reply With Quote
How about something a bit like this? Rescued attachment 500fun9.jpg
Rescued attachment 500fun9.jpg






Jon

View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
wildchild

posted on 11/4/06 at 01:41 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JonBowden
I'm not sure that many people would want to drive a super economy car. I think it might be viewed as indicating lack of success.
If however it were given a more positive spin then it might work.
Thus I would suggest that it should be :
Cool
Sporty (as in good acceleration and fab, fun handling).
Adequately practical
Inexpensive to buy
Cheap to run.

Of all of these, I suspect that coolness would be the most important.


There is a serious attitude problem in terms of the car as a status symbol, which goes some way to explaining why there are so many people sat in urban traffic jams in 4x4s.

I think you might struggle to market a super-economic city car, especially if the economy came by eliminating some of the creature comforts we love in our cars. Smart have done quite well in creating that 'cool' image.

I wasn't really thinking about a mainstream marketed car when I started this thread though, more about the engineering challenges of building one (as a one off) and the choices that you'd face. But both sides are quite an interesting topic.

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
Hammerhead

posted on 11/4/06 at 02:02 PM Reply With Quote
shame the G-Whiz looks like a mobility vehicle.

\/\/\/\/\/\/don't know how I got above you James\/\/\/\/\/\/

[Edited on 11/4/06 by Hammerhead]

[Edited on 11/4/06 by Hammerhead]

View User's Profile Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
James

posted on 11/4/06 at 02:32 PM Reply With Quote
The G-Wiz!

http://www.goingreen.co.uk/?PageID=AboutGWiz


Interesting article about it on the BBC from the program In Business:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/news/inbusiness/inbusiness_20051020.shtml


Emission free, costs 20p to fill up and sticks a couple of fingers up at the oil companies, the Middle East and the big motor companies. Yay!


Cheers,
James

[Edited on 11/4/06 by James]

[Edited on 11/4/06 by James]





------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights." - Muhammad Ali

View User's Profile View All Posts By User U2U Member
millenniumtree

posted on 11/4/06 at 04:04 PM Reply With Quote
We're moving to a small town this spring, and I've been thinking of this very subject! The vehicle I envision is sort of like a 4 wheeled gasoline assisted pedal car.

My requirements so far are:

dual-fuel (Gasoline and FOOT power)
4 bicycle tires - cheap to replace, brakes attached
2 seats, recumbant style
room for a week of groceries in the back
efficient 4-stroke engine with a good muffler

That's the basic design. Further improvements could include:

covered crew/cargo compartment for rainy travel,
electric motors instead of gas - allows for a flywheel and regenerative braking,
conventional shifter/clutch arrangement instead of the clunky derailler system used on bicycles.

I plan to find a cheap lawnmower engine (4 stroke preferred), weld up a chassis, and add the bike tires and pedals from a couple of used bicycles.
Estimated costs:
steel - 10 bucks
lawnmower - 20 bucks
2 bicycles - 20 bucks
other bits - 10 bucks

Even the steel from the bicycles could be recycled and used for chassis bits. I think the estimate of $60 is a bit high even.

If you wanted to get it road-legal, that's another story... May have to go as high as $200.

1/2 scale seven with a lawnmower engine and bike tires?

View User's Profile E-Mail User Visit User's Homepage View All Posts By User U2U Member
<<  1    2  >>
New Topic New Poll New Reply


go to top






Website design and SEO by Studio Montage

All content © 2001-16 LocostBuilders. Reproduction prohibited
Opinions expressed in public posts are those of the author and do not necessarily represent
the views of other users or any member of the LocostBuilders team.
Running XMB 1.8 Partagium [© 2002 XMB Group] on Apache under CentOS Linux
Founded, built and operated by ChrisW.