monck
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| posted on 13/11/12 at 11:22 PM |
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Just my thoughts
In my opinion i would not get a 7 as a first car its very impractical and i would get some driving experience in a normal car first . A large number
of new drivers have a smash in there first year and would be better if this was not in a 7 ...
Im now 21 bought a 7 with a 1.8 zetec at 19 still got it now with a 2.0 and changed to fuel injection love my car to bits but i could not drive it
everyday but i attempted to use it as my daily driver this summer and had a few issues
1) Neighbuors did not appreciate me starting her up at 4am to go to work ..
2) didn't want to leave it anywhere so that was a problem
3) no fun in the rain i did have a windscreen and roof earlier in the year and it was far from enjoyable like driving round in a tent ?
It seems kit cars are appealing to young drivers now as everyday drivers because the insurance is cheaper my insurance on my 2.0 tiger cat with a
declared 186hp is £700 fully comp for the year my 306 hdi 2.0 diesel road car is more and its SLOW but i love it ... 
Not saying don't do it but think about the practicality of it
[Edited on 13/11/12 by monck]
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jawskk
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| posted on 13/11/12 at 11:25 PM |
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i get what you saying, and alot to think about. All those arnt a problem for me , apart from maybe the rain and weather one. Will have to look at this
and speak with my brother. If i was to buy a kit car for my first car it would be the 7, so i guess theres alot to think about.
And i know what you mean, but its one of these, or i buy a motorbike, which both are very impractical! haha, im not a very practical guy when it comes
to thinking that far ahead. I'll sleep on it then right a reply on what i thought tomorrow morning.
Cheers
Jawsk
[Edited on 13/11/2012 by jawskk]
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jawskk
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| posted on 13/11/12 at 11:35 PM |
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is it possible for people to maybe list possibility's that look similar but have a convertible roof?
and what car is this?
Thanks
[Edited on 13/11/2012 by
jawskk]Car
[Edited on 13/11/2012 by jawskk]
[Edited on 13/11/2012 by jawskk]
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ReMan
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| posted on 13/11/12 at 11:39 PM |
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Recent thread might be interesting
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=174134&page=1
Fisher Fury
www.plusnine.co.uk
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computid
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 12:17 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by jawskk
is it possible for people to maybe list possibility's that look similar but have a convertible roof?
and what car is this?
Thanks
[Edited on 13/11/2012 by
jawskk]Car
[Edited on 13/11/2012 by jawskk]
[Edited on 13/11/2012 by jawskk]
The car is a Fisher Fury.
If it weren't for the new licensing rules after January then I'd recommend a motorbike.
Driving a RWD car in the wet, snow and ice isn't going to be fun. I really do think you'd be better off with a tin top. I know
they're not exciting and they cost a fair lump to insure but they're endlessly more practical.
I've got two Minari Road Sport Mk2's, one of which I used to use as a daily driver and the other has been used as a daily when the tin top
is out of action. They're ok, its great fun, but having to warm them up for 10 mins each morning, spending ages getting the screen to de-mist,
drying whatever got wet when it rained the night before and leaked through the roof etc. all takes time, probably more then you'll want to spend
day in day out.
In summer it can be great fun, but in winter its a real nightmare.
Just as an example, here are my two minari's:
and I've gotta say, this has happened more then once:
Don't expect whatever you buy to be hugely reliable, and after all kit cars always need fettling.
Your about 90 miles from me, if you'd like when the weathers a bit better and my interiors back together I'd be happy to meet you
somewhere in the middle, take you out for a run in a minari to give you an idea of what a kit car is like. Comparing a seven or similar to a Z4 is
like comparing a Learjet to a Eurofighter. They're not plush, but they are quick
TBH £1000 might buy you an ok project, but if I were you I'd save up another £1000 and buy something that isn't a seven that has a
registration number. I drove a kit car as my first car, yeah they're good fun but they tend to be very unforgiving and if you do happen to crash
one you probably won't fair too well.
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BangedupTiger
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 12:53 AM |
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Seeing as your interested in engineering, particularly motorsport. Surely the fun and experience of actually building a car is the main point.
Personally I'd buy a kit, that someone else has attempted to start, stoping due to either other commitments, financial constraints or just the
realisation of the work involved.
Insurance wise, do some checks yourself. Mines £180 on a tiger with a pinto (@27yrs old). My mate only pays £250ish on his 1000bhp ultima, everyone
will vary.
As for an everyday car, I wouldn't. But myself, like most others, have the luxury of a more sensible car for day to day.
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snapper
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 07:10 AM |
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First, talk a bit more with Eddy99 he has done exactly what you want to do
Second go for it, your only young once, make your dream and drive it
Me I realy, realy wished I'd started building cars decades before I started
Not as you vs as you but at 21 I had a Mk3 Triumph Spitfire, worked in London as a photographer and had a (one of my) girlfriend in Bradford, I would
drive there and back in the Spit
Just do it
Once you start the help from here will be amazing and very few very young people can say " I built a car" if I interview someone for a job
I look for that bit extra
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
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jawskk
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 08:15 AM |
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Thanks everyone for the great responses once again!
I fully understand what you mean by the weather and how unreliable it is etc. I'd prefer not getting to school, then finding out something has
fallen out the bottom, but surely thats the good thing about it. When i say that im sure lots of you will then laugh and question it. But what i mean
is, you've built it, so you know how to fix it! Unlike modern cars. We have a Citroen c3 2004 at our use for our first car if we want it, but
thats just has unreliable, and when something goes wrong on it, its covered in plastic casing and is such a puzzle to even know where to start, and
thats still a basic car. I'd like the fact I can tweek with it for extra power, and then when something does go wrong, i can pin point what it
is immediately!
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
Second go for it, your only young once, make your dream and drive it
I liked this quote as it kinda says everything really. I always use this in everything i do, because i think that should be one of the main driving
points ( see what i did there :L ) to get people to do what they want to do, because as i was told, and a huge example is my dad, is that he wants
comfort now hes getting older, but i couldn't careless about comfort, i want speed :L
Also, that was my first original idea, was to buy a kit and build it, but i can't seem to find any links to manufacturers? is there such things?
Also my other option was to buy a rolling chassis thats a complete mess, but i know was made to a standard but never finished, which i could then
spend a year on repainting, new engine, new interior etc.
Thanks alot
Jaws
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SCAR
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 09:17 AM |
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As others have said buy an unfished kit. You could pay about half what has already been spent so its much cheaper than starting from scratch. Then
take it apart and start again as you need to be sure of the build quality. If you start from scratch then almost certainly you will spend more than
the completed cars resale value.
You dont need a 130 bhp bike engined car, even a good 1300 crossflow in a 7 type will probably be quicker and certainly more fun than any main stream
car you can insure.
I dont want to judge you personally but as a new young driver if you try to use a bec to anywhere near its abilities (and its difficult to resist) you
will crash it.
Great to hear you are interested in building something yourself, let us know how you get on, its pity you are not near us.
Good luck
Steve
Team SCAR
[img]
 
Description
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Description
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[Edited on 14/11/12 by SCAR]
[Edited on 14/11/12 by SCAR]
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D Beddows
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 09:40 AM |
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As a parent of a 16 year old I suspect you're not going to listen to us old folk so go for it! There is a reason why people use these as fun
cars only and you will be able to advise the next generation as to what that is
You will enjoy building it though, man mecanno is always fun!
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blakep82
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 09:51 AM |
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don't underestimate the time it can take to build a car though, if you are 15 now, you would have been 5 when i started building mine... still
building...
it can be a long, confusing, expensive process (mine has no instructions, and' i've had to make up a lot of parts myself. back axle cost
me well over £1000 to put together too, but thats just mine) but if you want to do it, you need to get it done! do it!
thats the only way you'll decide for yourself if its the right thing for you, or if its too impractical
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
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40inches
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 10:16 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by snapper
First, talk a bit more with Eddy99 he has done exactly what you want to do
Second go for it, your only young once, make your dream and drive it
Me I realy, realy wished I'd started building cars decades before I started
Not as you vs as you but at 21 I had a Mk3 Triumph Spitfire, worked in London as a photographer and had a (one of my) girlfriend in Bradford, I would
drive there and back in the Spit
Just do it
Once you start the help from here will be amazing and very few very young people can say " I built a car" if I interview someone for a job
I look for that bit extra
Everthing that snapper says. I was 49 when I built my first kit, now 15 years later I have just "finished" my 3rd and probably last
I wish I had started much earlier, so much I would like to do re kit cars "sob"
If I was starting now, I would buy a finished and IVA'd car, you can pick them up at the moment for the price of the kit (well, almost)
strip down to the chassis, and rebuild it my way.
Linky Do Da
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jawskk
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 10:48 AM |
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Thanks alot for the responses,
firstly, just because im 16 doesn't make me not listen, im willing to listen to all the advice your willing to give to me. I like the idea of
buying a used car maybe a 7, then stripping in down and rebuilding it with new parts, that could be something i could do over next year and then drive
it when i turn 17?
I dont plan to build a car to powerful that is uncontrollable, but id like to have a car with a bit more power than the ordinally saxo has. I like the
bec idea as i think that the power and the noise would suite my personallity, although i would still be happy with a zetec 1.8 etc. But i will have to
look more into the possibilitys and insurance.
Just thought id also add that there are 2 of us building this, me and my brother making our budget near 2grand..
I was also Wondering if anyone could tell me how the January laws of motorbikes would affect insurance?
thanks
Jaws
Ps. ,sorry for spelling mistakes, using my phone.
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monck
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 12:37 PM |
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Not being funny or hate put a downer on things but if your joint budget is 2k if that's on the road i think your going to struggle to get a 7
type car on the road for that money... Could be wrong but i cant see it ..
My first years insurance at 19 insurance was just over a grand on a 1.8 zetec tiger if theirs 2 of you (one as main one and a named) i would imagine
it could be worse ...
Ryan
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computid
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 01:13 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by D Beddows
As a parent of a 16 year old I suspect you're not going to listen to us old folk
Speak for yourself
quote:
Originally posted by monck
Not being funny or hate put a downer on things but if your joint budget is 2k if that's on the road i think your going to struggle to get a 7
type car on the road for that money... Could be wrong but i cant see it ..
My first years insurance at 19 insurance was just over a grand on a 1.8 zetec tiger if theirs 2 of you (one as main one and a named) i would imagine
it could be worse ...
Ryan
I would too imagine it would be very expensive to insure a 1.8 at 17. The only insurance company I know of that will do kit car insurance for 17 year
olds (Footman James) won't insure you on an anything above a 1.6 (this is from personal experience with them) although they had no problems
insuring me on my 1.8 MG B GT, its all a bit hit and miss.
I know they're not a hugely popular car for a lot of reasons, but have you considered a Dutton Phaeton? They're very cheap to buy, often
have small engines and can be brilliant bargains. They can be kitted out with a soft-top and side screens and they can also be a lot of fun to drive
(despite the huge flaws in the chassis design!).
There are lots of other kit manufacturers out there. One kit car that did come to mind last night when I was thinking about it was a quantum. If I
were you I'd look at the quantum saloon, the coupe , the 2+2 or the H4. They're all pretty reasonable cars I think and they tend to be
fiesta/escort based meaning that they're fairly easy to maintain and usually have small engines. You could probably pick up a very good
condition on the road quantum for £2k and I doubt insurance would be that dear.
With regards to other kit car manufacturers there are quite a few in the UK alone: http://www.kitcarlinks.com/ukmakers.htm
You should probably visit a kit car show and have a look around the cars, most owners are happy to talk about their individual cars and let you have a
sit in them etc. I think the next show is the Kent Kit Car Show on the 13/14th of April.
With regards to motorbikes, the new laws will make absolutely no difference to your BEC insurance prices whatsoever. What they will do however is stop
you getting a full motorcycle licence for a number of years. This should cover all the bases:
http://lightningpass.com/eu-3rd-licensing-directive-3dld
EDIT: Another thought for a cheap sports car, what about the MEV Exocet? Based on an MX5 and MEV recon that after you've sold off the useless
MX5 bits it'll only cost £2k to build. http://www.mevltd.co.uk/exocet_price.htm
Not that you could easily fit one with a roof/windscreen/doors...
[Edited on 14/11/12 by computid]
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deezee
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 02:00 PM |
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I don't blame you for you're enthusiasm because everyone wants an awesome "Stand out from the crowd" car at 17. But thats why
insurance companies charge thousands for people your age. I'll echo what everyone else says on here. Go on Pistonheads, find a kitcar, ring up
an insurance company with the registration number and tell them its you're first car. See what the insurance cost for the two of you is going
to be. Then once you have that, come back on here and we'll talk you to death about technical details. To be honest I doubt you'll get
quoted.
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D Beddows
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 02:18 PM |
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For £2K on the road you're really going to struggle to get anything much more than a Dutton (maybe a Sylva Leader if you're lucky) and
forget building your 1st 7 for that and getting it on the road unfortunately
If your not careful you might well end up with a large pile of expensive rusty car bits in a garage and no car to drive once you've past your
test - I'd SERIOUSLY consider the usual hatchback route and THEN think about a kit car if you want to actually drive a car when you're
17.......
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jawskk
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 02:24 PM |
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hmm, so very mixed views from whether i will get insured or not, i guess the only way to find out would be to ask.
Just to comfirm that the £2000 would be a starting budget. Then every month we will get £50. Then our parents said when it comes to insuring they will
also do what they did for our older brother which was paid for his first year or so, at £1400?
I like the look of the dutton? that looks more practical and still looks good, anymore info on this car?
Also what engine would you suggest then, bec or cec, 1.6 or 1.8,
This is now getting confusing :L
When you say the insurance will be high, are we talking as if for a tin top, or are we saying it will be high for a kit car,?
Cheers
jaws
@EDIT.... just to make sure we don't get mistaken. I currently have £2000 and so does my brother, that will be the starting point. Over the year
we will then add any money we work around christmas for. so lets say £200... then 50 every month for 12 months... so thats £600? so its
2000
200
600
--------
2800 to get the kit built, and on the road, but no insurance... should of made that more clear :L
[Edited on 13/11/2012 by jawskk]
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D Beddows
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 03:45 PM |
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Don't underestimate the cost of kit cars - this maybe Locostbuilders but that doesn't mean this is low cost!!
There is a general rule of thumb that you can choose 2 out of these 3:
Quick To Build
Cheap (and £2800 is cheap believe me!)
Quality Build
worth thinking about........ I know quick to build and cheap probably sounds tempting BUT you'll spend more time rebodging things than you will
driving it
[Edited on 14/11/12 by D Beddows]
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BangedupTiger
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 04:18 PM |
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I've got a tiger (one of the cheaper options) total cost is around £10,000 and still going.
Personally i'd always go CEC, but i'm looking at new power upgrades (400bhp plus). A bike engine just wont cut it. although a sequential
box would be awesome.
for £2k, you end up with a bag of bolts, if looking at a finished car. Buy a 2nd hand kit.
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jawskk
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 04:20 PM |
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can i vote for cheap and quality build? i have plenty of time? and plenty of mates with workshops on hand
But I like the idea of the one about getting one thats more run down, and had a few miles. Stripping it down to the chassis, then practically
rebuilding it? no welding unless there is major structural issues! then how much a lick of paint, new interior and some new rims and a 1.6 or a bike
engine cost?
We like to think we are priddy good at finding bargains from Ebay, we use the idea of sitting and waiting :L for instance currently on ebay
there's 4 brand new wolf face rims 18" in matt black and crome up for £256 which is cheaper than i've ever seen them we were
going to do it like that, and do it all diy, for instance the interior panel, varnish wood? thats not expensive and i can do it at lunches in school
I was also looking at second hand, none of it was going to be brand new. even the engine we plan to put in will be second hand ripped out of a volvo
or an old zetec.
Thanks
Mike
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jawskk
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 04:35 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by computid:
Another thought for a cheap sports car, what about the MEV Exocet? Based on an MX5 and MEV recon that after you've sold off the useless MX5 bits
it'll only cost £2k to build. http://www.mevltd.co.uk/exocet_price.htm
The MEV Exocet looks incredible! are we looking at the same thing? heres what im looking at....
http://www.mevltd.co.uk/exocet_gallery.htm
Is that what you mean is cheap, or am i looking a the more modern version of it? or completely looking at the wrong thing? any pictures or links to
what you mean?
Thanks
Mike
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monck
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 04:38 PM |
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Hi Mike , if you really want to go for it id say the following
You may be able to get a run down car maybe something with a pinto xflow or something for under 3k
Zetec powered that are iva'd seem to make £4.5k+ it seems and BEC are even more
Just ring a insurance company i doubt they would quote you on a bec or a zetec at best id try a small crosflow or cvh
No point discussing options like zetec bec ect if you wont actually get cover
Just my opinion and how i would go about it
[Edited on 14/11/12 by monck]
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SCAR
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 04:44 PM |
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Or build a 7 from Ron Chapions book you can do it for £250 apparently
A word of advice, you would probably have to add at least 3k to any figures a kit supplier gives you for a budget build
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deezee
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| posted on 14/11/12 at 04:51 PM |
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Seriously, get off the PC and start ringing insurance companies before they close for business today. See if they'll insure a 17 year old with
no experience and zero no claims. I think I'll take this thread seriously once you have an idea of insurance, a budget for mechanic tools,
equipment and consumables. Otherwise its beginning to sound like the talk my 4 apprentices have at work but they ended up as; Mums Corsa, 1ltr Mini,
driving ban and scooter.
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