coozer
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 12:13 PM |
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More misery from Central Gov!
Cars 'to be seized and crushed' in insurance crackdown....
They really are trying to make people into criminals....
THIS has been talked about
before but now you need to insure all them bits of scrap and lonley log books you have lying around....
My Jago is in a thousand bits and unrecognisable as a vehicle atm, never mind using on the road! Its not sorned as the last time it was taxed was
before the scheme started. I fear some presence from the law soon...
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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britishtrident
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 12:22 PM |
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The vehicles is question are those which are taxed and not insured, if you have SORNed your vehicle and returnrd the tax disc you are OK.
However we must beware for the future this government can't be trusted.
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JimSpencer
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 12:24 PM |
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No don't agree with you on this one - there's just far too many uninsured cars on the road to do nowt.
The requirement to either Insure it - or SORN it - isn't onerous, I mean doing a sorn takes about 30 seconds if you can use a PC
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DRC INDY 7
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 12:33 PM |
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Another piece of sloppy journalism with a sloppy headline.
Lord Montague and classic car collectors may rest easy, along with those people keeping unused vehicles off the highway.
The government is simply saying if you own an untaxed vehicle and have failed to complete a SORN declaration, if, after you have been told to insure
it and you do not by a specified date, it will be crushed.
At present the law requires the offender to be seen DRIVING the uninsured vehicle, the offence will be to OWN an uninsured vehicle, full stop.
SORN will still apply to vehicles kept on private property, and to drive a vehicle with a SORN declaration remains an offence.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/462610273778799/
Puddle Dodgers Club
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Strontium Dog
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 12:42 PM |
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What a load of bollocks. Why should I have to declare that I'm not going to drive my pile of spare parts in the first place? It's not
going to prevent anyone from driving illegaly if that's what they want to do anyway. It just means that people like me and Coozer will sooner or
later drop the ball and get fined and lose our legaly owned property to the rapidly becoming facist state!
What it is about is preventing people like us recycling cars and forcing us to buy new cars which we all know is just a way of extracting yet more
money out of us while doing NOTHING to help the enviroment. The best thing you can do is keep driving your old cars and keep them going preferably
with second hand parts, but no taxes to gather there so not what the government wants even though it is the best thing for the planet as a whole!
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MakeEverything
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 12:50 PM |
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I think this could be a great idea, as long as the insurance companies update the police databases quicker than they do already.
Had an incident a few weeks before christmas where the old bill were asking why my company car wasnt insured. Turns out, the insurance company hadnt
updated the records. Ive had the car 6 months!
Kindest Regards,
Richard.
...You can make it foolProof, but youll never make it Idiot Proof!...
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britishtrident
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 12:58 PM |
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As I have posted before unless we have a system that legally allows people to move basically roadworthy but untaxed vehicles people will break the
law. With the insurance companies offering one day cover we are part of the way towards it, whats needed is single day a trade plate like scheme for
the general public.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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britishtrident
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 01:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MakeEverything
I think this could be a great idea, as long as the insurance companies update the police databases quicker than they do already.
Had an incident a few weeks before christmas where the old bill were asking why my company car wasnt insured. Turns out, the insurance company hadnt
updated the records. Ive had the car 6 months!
I suspect the main target is disqualified drivers who buy vehicles with several months tax then run the car uninsured.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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Neville Jones
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 01:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Strontium Dog
What a load of bollocks. Why should I have to declare that I'm not going to drive my pile of spare parts in the first place? It's
not going to prevent anyone from driving illegaly if that's what they want to do anyway. It just means that people like me and Coozer will
sooner or later drop the ball and get fined and lose our legaly owned property to the rapidly becoming facist state!
What it is about is preventing people like us recycling cars and forcing us to buy new cars which we all know is just a way of extracting yet more
money out of us while doing NOTHING to help the enviroment. The best thing you can do is keep driving your old cars and keep them going preferably
with second hand parts, but no taxes to gather there so not what the government wants even though it is the best thing for the planet as a whole!
You seem to not understand what is being said.
If you have a 'pile of spare parts', and/or are recycling into self built vehicles, then you would surely keep the V5's on a SORN,
wouldn't you?
The only people this affects are those who own a car and keep it off road, and have not SORNed it.
SORN it or insure it. It's not that difficult to understand, is it?
Cheers,
Nev.
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coozer
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 01:30 PM |
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So the sorn date slips by... the law come knocking, and you end up with a conviction for no insurance, that knocks your premium up for 10 years and
gives you 6~9 points... all for a pile of classic car parts that you would love to restore and use again, some day.
Why not have more cops out on the street with ANPR and catch the real villains.
I wish my olds had been convicts and got sent down under
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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The Baron
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 01:35 PM |
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This country is just going down the pan with the hike in taxes etc,
Would the last one out please turn off the lights......
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LBMEFM
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 01:47 PM |
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Under the new offence of keeping a vehicle while uninsured, the onus will be on drivers to prove that they have insurance, or have completed a
statutory off-road notification.
Drivers/Cars should be insured, if you pride and joy is SORN'd you are OK.
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Neville Jones
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 02:17 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by coozer
I wish my olds had been convicts and got sent down under.
In Aus, you pay your Third Party insurance in your registration(road tax) automatically. No rego, and you have to hand your plates back. Cops can
confiscate your plates on the spot!
Also, roadside vehicle roadworthy checks, on a portable ramp towed by an artic. Now you think you're hard up?
Cheers,
Nev.
[Edited on 9/1/11 by Neville Jones]
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ChrisW
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 03:22 PM |
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I'm all for this. It's not like you'd tax a car if you weren't going to use it. I've got four of my five cars
'off the road' at the moment, none are insured, none are taxed. They're all locked away, reasonably inaccessible (theft prevention)
and anyone could see that they're not used on the road.
For the majority of legitimate drivers, builders, restorers etc there will be no change.
What I will be annoyed about is if they're too heavy handed with the fines. I try to keep on top of the SORN declarations, but I do forget to
renew them sometimes, and I'd be annoyed if a fine dropped through the door in that case without a reasonable warning letter in advance. Why
they have to be renewed anyway every year is beyond me. Once the car is off the road it's off the road until I want to use it again (due to
weather usually), or have finished whatever work I want to do on it. I don't think 'oh, it's a year since I last used it, time to
get it out again'.
Chris
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scootz
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 04:29 PM |
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Lot of huffing and puffing here about the possibility of getting caught out... come on guys... they even send you a REMINDER to tell you
it's SORN time!
Where's the problem!?
It's Evolution Baby!
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Confused but excited.
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 04:54 PM |
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And it only takes two minutes to do online.
What are all the tears about?
If you drive whilst not insured you should be flogged for a first offence.
Tell them about the bent treacle edges!
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ianclark1275
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 06:33 PM |
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i take it this applies to cars with tax liability since SORN came out?
old cars which have never been SORN'd would remain that way?
LBL 6D 1967 monte carlo winning mini cooper is Unlicensed----it is unlikely to government would crush it? well knowing this lot.
im sure museums up and down the country wont have to fill out a load of forms annually
therefore if your pile of scrap / parts has never had a SORN / RECENT TAX, then it looks fine.
i forget to sorn cars all the time, its take 2 minutes of my time to update goverment databases.
what do i get, 2 mins longer on my road tax!!
IC
measure twice, cut once, scrap it, start again.
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suparuss
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 07:19 PM |
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what if i have an old landrover for offroading and picking up materials for my buisness and nice family car for not F@@@@@g up by piling wood into it
and cant afford to insure both so keep the landrover off the road and put temp insurance on it when i want to use it?
fact is reason i cant afford to insure both is because insurance is compulsary which means insurance companies can charge what they like. government
want this because of the insurance tax plus the tax on profits from insurance companies which is why theyve been feeding you propaganda for years
about no insurance been as bad as rape. does it hurt more if you get hit by someone with no insurance? your insurance pays you, problem solved. other
countries work with a non compulsary insurance system so why cant we? because of all the naive f@@@wits who listen to every bit of BS the government
spout out at them. THEY JUST WANT YOUR MONEY!!!!!!!!
im really not suprised that so many people find it acceptable that their is a possibilty that we could be prosecuted for not having insurance without
proof that you use the vehicle. i know it is f@@@@@g ridiculous but the majority of this country are complete morons.
just like to point out that i have zero points on my license and my landrover is fully insured and still saving to have a nice family car with better
economy than the landrover which is hard when we are paying £1.30 a liter at the pump, most of which is tax which is what all this is about really
isnt it!!!!! insurance tax, fuel tax, road tax, etc etc etc etc. THEY JUST WANT YOUR MONEY!!!! if i say it enough will it sink in? probably not sadly.
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scootz
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 07:40 PM |
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Hope that didn't take too long to type out...
It's Evolution Baby!
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40inches
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 07:46 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by scootz
Lot of huffing and puffing here about the possibility of getting caught out... come on guys... they even send you a REMINDER to tell you
it's SORN time!
Where's the problem!?
Wot he said, simples init?
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britishtrident
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 08:24 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by scootz
Lot of huffing and puffing here about the possibility of getting caught out... come on guys... they even send you a REMINDER to tell you
it's SORN time!
Where's the problem!?
For how much longer ? wait for very soon they will start charging for SORN just a fiver or so at first they will call it an administration fee, then
it will creep up.
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Brook_lands
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 08:37 PM |
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This is not an SORN issue, they have been able to clamp and impound non taxed vehicles for a while – this is a yet more hurdles, red tape and messing
about for basically law abiding folk who try and stay the right side of the law but are being given ever increased opportunities to be the wrong
side.
For those that don’t tax and insure vehicles this is just one more law they will ignore. This will catch those who have tax but for some reason no
insurance on a vehicle, and it will be a nice little earner for DVLA/ Government
So I decide to park up my car (in my garage) today because the insurance has run out and I can’t afford to insure it until of end of the month. I now
have to declare SORN send off tax disc and get a refund which will be from 1st Feb. Now I get paid on 25th of the month, so I want to insure my car
and get going again – but wait it is not taxed! I can either re-tax it – but this one will now start from 1st Jan so I’ve paid twice for Jan for only
using the car for 2 weeks or I have wait until 1st Feb. And as it takes 4 weeks for the DVLA to send my money back I now can’t afford to tax it
anyway.
I go on away from home for 6 weeks and leave my taxed and insured car legally parked. It pings as uninsured because of a data error, I’ve not declared
SORN, I’m not there to receive mail so potentially bye bye car.
I tax and insure my car, and when I can’t afford either I don’t use it until I can pay – but that’s because I care and I have no truck with those who
don’t pay their dues and drive uninsured, but I just think this will make not one jot of difference to them.
Continuous taxation and SORN was the answer to untaxed and uninsured cars.
Then ANPR would put an end to it.
Now continuous insurance will end it.
No it won’t, the number will continue to rise. If I slip up, forget, or my bit of paper goes missing then I will get caught because I tell DVLA who I
am and where I live. Those that don’t care don’t bother so comparing a list of taxed cars with a list of insured cars won’t find them. This is just
yet more (junk) justice on the cheap via junk mail mail-shot, next they will be subcontracting to Reader’s Digest because they are very efficient at
sending out unwanted mail.
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Dear Mr Smith,
You have been selected to receive a fine of £100 pounds. Imagine what your neighbours will think of you when a brand new shiny recovery truck is
parked out side your house to take your car to be crushed.
There is now time to loose, send you cheque by return.
And please remember to keep your details up to date with us for the opportunity to win more big fines in the future. Don’t miss out on the chance
of:
- A super £80 fine because we lost your SORN document
- £1000 penalty because we didn’t point out that your new photo licence only last 10 years
- £120 fine because our camera operator spotted that your front wheel crossed the white line and entered a bus lane for 2 seconds.
Make sure your family don’t miss out on all this fun, make sure we have their details as well.
Yours truly,
Mr Grabit
Fines Draw Manager
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Come to think about it I may be onto something here!
How do you get on Dragons' Den? - This must be worth £100k of anybody's money and then I wouldn't care because I could afford to tax
and insure my car for next year or two.
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snapper
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 08:44 PM |
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YOU HAVE NOT READ THE WHOLE ARTICLE....
quote
Under the new offence of keeping a vehicle while uninsured, the onus will be on drivers to prove that they have insurance, or have completed a
statutory off-road notification.
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
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Volvorsport
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| posted on 9/1/11 at 09:00 PM |
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this reminds me , i havent had a sorn for one of my cars for years , how does that work then ?
www.dbsmotorsport.co.uk
getting dirty under a bus
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coyoteboy
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| posted on 10/1/11 at 03:35 AM |
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I just don't get it. Why would you NOT declare the car SORN? Is it such a hassle to pop online and say "I'm not using this at the
moment so if "it" or its reg is spotted out and about you know it's illegal"? Seriously, there's no down side.
quote:
So the sorn date slips by...
Are you REALLY forgetful? IT illiterate? I mean I'm not being rude here at all, or at least not intending to be, but how do you forget to SORN?
When you buy the vehicle for a donor - SORN it. When you decide not to renew the tax on your ever disparate pile of spares you declare it SORN when
the renewal comes. And every year you get a reminder to re-SORN, and all it takes is the code off the letter they send and 30 seconds on the
internet.
Just don't get the aggro people seem to work up about it. Been SORNing my GT4 for 3 years now, I've no problems doing so at all. You might
think it's not "required", you might think it doesn't hit the people it should, but at the end of the day it's bugger
all inconvenience to stay within the law. And if you're the sort of person who forgets to re-SORN, maybe you're the sort that forgets to
re-insure, or re-tax, and I'll be glad you're given a hefty reminder!
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