flak monkey
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 05:28 PM |
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I am glad this forum...
...exists and we are able to moderate our own discussions more or less.
Jeez, I rarely get in trouble on the forums...
There was me thinking that I would answer a question on a hifi forum about biamping.
Heres the link:
http://community.whathifi.com/forums/2/574564/ShowThread.aspx
I posted a link in my original reply which was this one:
http://forum.blu-ray.com/speakers/56058-bi-amping-bi-wiring-research-material.html
Which obviously as its based on science rather than hifi myth got edited out with no reason given. I cant even find in the AUP where that says I cant
link to other sites. I questioned why the link had been removed and you can see what happened to my post. So then I copied and quoted the key bits
from the link above and had that removed again. So posted again putting it in my own words and suggested that if anyone would like to learn more about
the superposition principle and how it applies to hifi that they should google 'superposition principle biamping' and have a read for
themselves and make their own mind up. That bit of my post was then removed. So I have put it in my last post on the topic as well, see if it goes
again.
Its a pet hate of mine that theres this perpetuated myth that we should spend twice as much on cables and amps because it makes a difference, when
scientifically it cant and doesnt. Active biamping is a different beast, but impossible with 99% of hifi speakers.
I am a science geek and I hate to see people wasting their money on things that can't make a difference realistically. But as they have just
spent £2k on cables the expectation bias is overwhelming...
Anyway, rant over. I am off to listen to some music! 
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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tegwin
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 06:09 PM |
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A lot of people are unwilling or simply dont want to "believe" in science. If they want to spend their hard earned cash on
"special" cables etc... then they can do so... I know its annoying when people simply dont see "sense"....
Its like that with a lot of things I am finding.. sometimes its better to just bite your tongue and keep the "real facts" quiet.....
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Would the last person who leaves the country please switch off the lights and close the door!
www.verticalhorizonsmedia.tv
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balidey
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 06:24 PM |
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Hifi geeks are a weird lot. All that crackle, hiss, jumping and scratching from old vinyl yet they seem to think it sounds better.
Don't they know that CD is the future?
Dutch bears have terrible skin due to their clogged paws
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Gordy
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 06:35 PM |
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Hi flack monkey, i've got an Avi pre amp + monoblocks and was thinking of buying another 2 monoblocks to biamp my speakers, are you saying this
is pointless?
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snapper
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 06:36 PM |
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I think we could do with a myth breaker thread.
Here's one, you don't need a Pinto 205 block.
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
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r1_pete
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 06:40 PM |
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They are blind to the facts, due to the overwhelming desire to maintain the justification for spending the money they have for no benefit.
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Benzine
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:00 PM |
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moderating an external link XD Well you have to really, it's one step away from full out anarchy, if everyone linked to other things on the net
then the human race has pretty much had it
I'd love to listen to this loud on a flip hot audio system
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0XwOjSpdbc
Edit: just realised I linked to an external site, can the next moderator to view this post please punish me
[Edited on 8/2/11 by Benzine]
The mental gymnastics a landlord will employ to justify immoral actions is clinically fascinating. Just because something is legal doesn't make
it moral.
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flak monkey
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:01 PM |
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Now its got into horizontal and vertical biamping. The inductive load is the same irrespective if you have the speaker xover fitted. *face palm*
Equally the reason people are hearing differences with the Arcam amps is they have introduced another different model of amp with inevitably different
gains. Probably using the more powerful poweramp to drive the bass/mid so will hear a difference because they have *upset* the balance.
Oh well. I have threatened before, and I think I am going to do it. I am going to go into making hifi interconnects, no fancy jargon or advertising
but if anyone can empiracally prove they are any better or worse than ones costing £1k+ i'll refund their money.
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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bigpig
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:03 PM |
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Its all a bit bizarre really. Some of these people could do with having their ears syringing which would improve the sound no end.
Positioning speakers makes an effect on sound, but there is no point in being anal about it all when you can sit incorrectly.
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russbost
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:11 PM |
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"I think we could do with a myth breaker thread.
Here's one, you don't need a Pinto 205 block."
You're right Paul, what you really need is a ZZR1400!!!
Edited to add that anyone stupid enough to believe that spending £2k on cables could make a hearable difference to Hi Fi deserves to have their money
taken!!
  
[Edited on 8/2/11 by russbost]
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prawnabie
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:13 PM |
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I tend to find anyone who is a .....phile very easy to wind up!
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blakep82
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:14 PM |
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a big set of speakers (mine are cerwin vega ve-12) and a good amp to run them (mines 100watts rms per channel) good enough fo me. any more than that
is just getting a bit silly 
want a 200watt amp now though..
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
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flak monkey
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:23 PM |
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I love hifi, its great fun. But I prefer to spend my money on amps and sources which do change the sound than gimmicks which dont.
Take my new pre-amp. Its a valve based one driving two solid state monoblocs. Weird combination? Yes but it sounds lovely for the sort of music I
listen to. Huge soundstage, great mids and bass with nice soft, detailed treble. Everybody likes something different, it just winds me up that
companies get away with shoving cables and other things on people when they make no difference.
Have a look at this:
Clicky
90% on wigwam agree cables do nothing, which I like and is why I hang about on there more than WHF. But $12k for speaker cables? Scroll down and look
whats in the box of tricks and read Serges post (hes an electronics engineer) about the effect. The companies should be ashamed and it should be
exposed as a scam.
Funny enough Russ Andrews has just lost a court case about the effects of his mains cables....
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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iank
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:31 PM |
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My favourite was when a few years ago Maplins were selling gold plated mains plugs.
If you can come up with some pseudo scientific babble you can sell £1 worth of cable for £1k - good money if you don't have any morals.
--
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.
Anonymous
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dinosaurjuice
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:34 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by flak monkey
Have a look at this:
Clicky
thats hilarious a passive RC filter siliconed into a box, they should get these guys on bbc's hustle!
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rayward
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:37 PM |
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from that thread....
"EDITED BY MODS - please do not discuss moderation "
you really are getting your wrists slapped there...!!!!
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Peteff
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:40 PM |
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Gold plated plugs make everything sound better it's a proven fact We have an ancient Aiwa stack deck with two speakers and a Technics 5 disc
changer stuck on top. I've worked in foundries and factories with noisy machinery all my life and rode motorbikes with no earplugs in so I have
to turn everything up just to drown out the tinitus. You might be able to read the differences between different systems and configurations with
sensitive audio equipment but to me it will still sound like somebody playing the drums underwater.
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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flak monkey
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:42 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by rayward
from that thread....
"EDITED BY MODS - please do not discuss moderation "
you really are getting your wrists slapped there...!!!!
All I asked was why the link had been removed from my original post, which was the link in my OP in this thread.
It was relevant to the point I was making and not offensive. Its that what annoyed me more than anything else to be honest! I have posted links to
other sites before and never had a problem.
I never had a PM from anyone explaining why, just that message left on one of my posts and the contents deleted!
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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Gordy
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 07:57 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by flak monkey
90% on wigwam agree cables do nothing, which I like and is why I hang about on there more than WHF. But $12k for speaker cables? Scroll down and look
whats in the box of tricks and read Serges post (hes an electronics engineer) about the effect. The companies should be ashamed and it should be
exposed as a scam.
what do you connect your components together with ? i think you'll find most people with nice kit will use branded hifi cables (chord qed atlas
etc etc) to connect their system together, and if thats the case they've already bought into the hype, are you saying you only use patch leads
and bell wire.
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lsdweb
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 08:02 PM |
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I didn't understand a word of what was being said on that forum but it still sounds (excuse the pun) a bit over the top to moderate you for what
you are saying Flak Monkey!
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flak monkey
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 08:05 PM |
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Theres a difference between cheap freebie cables as they arent normally shielded properly or very well made for repeated connections being made and
broken. Similarly with speaker cable, I only use decently thick stuff as a powerful amp will shove a lot of current down it if it can (10amps peak or
more)
I buy interconnects costing between £10 and £20 to get something thats nicely made and I paid less than £5/m for my speaker cable secondhand.
But you'll find most people running the sort of system I do spending upwards of £100each on interconnects and £30/m+ on speaker cable
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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Richard Quinn
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 08:09 PM |
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But this is an everyday occurrence in almost every topic area now. It smacks a little of the Emperors new clothes really and just shows that marketing
is in fact the most powerful "science" out there.
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rf900rush
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 08:28 PM |
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HIFI BS does make me chuckle especially ICE.
Many years back I was told to use, good old mains Twin and earth for speakers.
I guess things have changed now.
Made my day when I found out my old home made speakers fitted with KEF units were still worth money.
Anyway I to deaf now.
The wifes got one for the "I need More power" guys.
And she cant lift it any more. at 24.5 Kg's
On my calculations that's a peak current of 40 amps into 4 ohms. (bridge configuration)
I wounder what cables this would need.
 
[Edited on 8/2/11 by rf900rush]
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scudderfish
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 08:36 PM |
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10 amps isn't a lot. Look at the thinwall cable in your car rated higher than that 
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scudderfish
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| posted on 8/2/11 at 08:37 PM |
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BTW, I've chortled heartily in the past at gold plated plugs on optical interconnects
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