ShaunB
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 02:46 PM |
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Yellow tape on engine to chassis earth lead?
My scrutineer at Snet said that I should have yellow tape on the engine to chassis earth lead in case the marshals need to get busy with the wire
cutters - is he correct? He did not seem the most with it scrut as he started by pointing at the thick red lead coming through the bulkhead and going
to the solenoid and asked "Is that your earth lead?" - err no, that would be my main +12v supply from the master switch. I point out the
battery in the passenger compartment, along with the yellow taped battery to chassis earth lead, but he was still adamant that I also yellow taped
engine to chassis earth too.
That seems wrong to me as cutting that lead would stop the engine (possibly...) but not isolate anything else and I wouldn't want the marshals
to think they'd cut the main earth when the battery and all ancilleries are still fully connected.
His parting shot was saying that technically my lights would fail an MOT as they were not within 80mm of the outside of the car and the brake lights
should be outermost. I pointed out that every car I'd ever owned and all the ones we could see (at least 10 cars) had the indicators outermost,
but yes I would concede the 80mm point however he'd have to fail half the field if he was looking to enforce that one.
Shaun.
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 02:57 PM |
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Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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britishtrident
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 03:03 PM |
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Yellow paint is the usual method for marketing earth leads but ISTR that it is not required if it is blatantly obvious which is the earth lead
---- ie exposed metal braid.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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ShaunB
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 03:03 PM |
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Thanks for that, think I'll print a copy out. So the figure is 400mm not 80mm. Never seen a racer with reflectors either...
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blakep82
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 03:07 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ShaunB
Thanks for that, think I'll print a copy out. So the figure is 400mm not 80mm. Never seen a racer with reflectors either...
well, thats an sva/iva diagram for positions. so MOT 'shouldn't' be different. seems to me the scrutineer made mistakes and
couldn't admit he was wrong lol
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
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lsdweb
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 03:26 PM |
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He's wrong - Appendix J (why is it not
in K - Safety ??!!) states:
5.14.5. Have the battery earth lead, if not readily distinguishable, identified by a yellow marking.
Pointing this out to him probably wouldn't have helped though! I once had a run in with a scrutineer who insisted I taped up the sunroof on a
standard production car - when I asked where it was in the Blue Book he told me that's the rule for road rallies (I was doing a sprint) and it
was just in case I rolled. He wasn't impressed when I asked if I should tape up all the other glass too......
Wyn
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ko_racer
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 03:47 PM |
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The rule is in the blue book for the marking of -ve lead in yellow.
We had the same thing in Bikesports at Snett on Sunday, but they also made us wrap red tape round the coolant pipes. Never seen a car with cold
coolant pipes after a race myself.
Got the whole grid into park ferme after qually and wouldn't let us leave until we had all the pipes and lead marked up appropriatly. All
helped by the usual "not my problem" attitude, I thought I'd read in one of the msa scrutineers newsletters they were trying to
improve their customer skills...
While I know we have to stick to the rules and it is our responsibility to check (I've never heard of the red tape one before), why not tell all
the competitors they are going to be checking things like this before the event and then have a word with the people who ignore this at scrineering in
the morning. It would save much time and hassle for both the competitor and the scrutneers.
I could understand why you would do it this way if you were going to give out some kind of punishemnt for not complying, but if all you have to do is
rectify it why not tell people before hand.
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loggyboy
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 04:05 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ko_racer
We had the same thing in Bikesports at Snett on Sunday, but they also made us wrap red tape round the coolant pipes. Never seen a car with cold
coolant pipes after a race myself.
I thought red fluid carrying pipes were only for when they were located in the driver/passenger comparment?
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eddie99
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 04:22 PM |
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As keith said above, we all got pulled in bikesports after practice on Sunday to make sure we had a yellow tape on the earth lead. This is because the
marshals have been told to cut the wire with the yellow tape in emergency.
http://www.elitemotorsporteng.co.uk/
Twitter: @Elitemotoreng
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Elite-Motorsport-Engineering/153409081394323
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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jollygreengiant
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 05:28 PM |
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As an mot tester I never had to check the location of the lights appart from did it have the obligatory lamps. the only measuring we did was the
height of the haed lamps which slightly affected the beam aim.
Beware of the Goldfish in the tulip mines. The ONLY defence against them is smoking peanut butter sandwiches.
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Macbeast
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 06:04 PM |
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Cutting the -ve to the engine seems odd. All that would do would be remove the high-current connections to the starter and the alternator. And if
you're sensible you have a second strap from the gearbox to the chassis.
The engine would find a path to negative through the diff mounting and / or the wheel bearings. Cutting the engine -ve probably wouldn't stop
the engine but if anybody operated the starter afterwards it would probably fry the instruments and throttle cable and might just pass 200A through
the petrol tank 
I'm addicted to brake fluid, but I can stop anytime.
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lsdweb
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 06:07 PM |
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And if it's solid mounted (bike engine) you'd have to grind off the engine mounts..........
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lsdweb
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 06:07 PM |
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Chief Scrutineer at our last hillclimb insisted competition numbers were black on a white background - we even had specific instructions as part of
the final instructions. In fact, the blue book says nothing about black numbers!
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ShaunB
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 06:20 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by lsdweb
Chief Scrutineer at our last hillclimb insisted competition numbers were black on a white background - we even had specific instructions as part of
the final instructions. In fact, the blue book says nothing about black numbers!
Actually it does in the same section J you quoted earlier:
4.1. Numbers must be displayed in a durable manner and be black, of a minimum size of 23cm high with stroke width of a minimum of 3.8cm on a
white oblong background measuring not less than 48cm x 33cm which must extend at least 5cm beyond the outline of the numbers.
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lsdweb
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 06:35 PM |
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Yes, but,
9.2.5. Cars will be identified by means of a competition number, allocated by the organisers, which must be visible from each side of the vehicle and
displayed on a contrasting background in a proper and durable way.......
Doesn't have to be black on white.....
Sprints, Hillclimbs and Drag Racing- Appendix S
Confusing!
[Edited on 24/5/11 by lsdweb]
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a4gom
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 07:34 PM |
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For some reason I usually seem to do alright with the srute's but from my experience and watching others I'd say if you have the
capability to alter or add what he requests / recommends it's far easier to do so. If you don't then drag out the blue book or point him
at the other cars he's just passed.
Andy
Perfect planning prevents pi$$ poor performance!
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procomp
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 07:47 PM |
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Hi Shaun
There is a whole load of queries and items that are going to be discussed with the scrutineers in the near future as there is a list being prepared as
we speak. I will add the Yellow marking of the engine to chassis earth lead to that list.
If you have any requests for clarification on any of the actual Locost regulations or general Blue book regulations let me know and ill add them
also.
But as said always best to nod head and agree on the day for an easy life.
Cheers Matt
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loggyboy
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 07:53 PM |
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Id carry a copy of the 2011 blue book in my back pocket and whip it out dangle it infront of his nose!
But as you all know - Im an argumentative sort of chap!
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ShaunB
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| posted on 24/5/11 at 09:20 PM |
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Yeah nod head and agree (well apart from the indicators on the inside bit, but he laughed that one off when I pointed out all the evidence around us)
was exactly what I did and he wrote me the pass ticket there and then. He did point out a couple of yellow ring terminals which could possibly cause
a marshal confusion in the heat of dealing with an incident and I was happy to tape over those to hide the yellow colour. The engine earth lead I was
not happy with as others have said the engine would continue to run using coolant temp/oil pressure sensor leads as earths until they burn out.
Matt - a couple points of clarification 1) do I actually need a horn fitted? It's an MOT requirement but I don't see many others running
one. 2) Rain light - if it's to be treated as a fog light for the MOT requirement then it should only come on once the sidelights are also
on...or can it be separately switched as long as it goes off with the master switch.
Cheers,
Shaun.
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lsdweb
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| posted on 25/5/11 at 07:24 AM |
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quote:
But as you all know - Im an argumentative sort of chap!
No you're not........ 
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