PSpirine
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| posted on 4/4/12 at 08:12 PM |
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Help me with engine choice!
I'm still keeping an eye out on ebay for an engine for my Haynes Roadster, but could do with some input on my options.
I want something that I'll be able to turbo (I have a turbo already), and I'll be running Megasquirt (which I already have). I currently
have a MT75 gearbox and Ford DOHC starter motor, so easy to bolt in a Zetec, but wouldn't mind buying a package complete with gearbox.
I'm after approx 200-250hp on standard internals. Not too fussed about figures, more about driveability.
I really really want to avoid a Cat for IVA, for plumbing issues as much as anything else.
Here are my options:
1) Zetec - Ideally a 2.0 Black top, but I really want to avoid a Cat for IVA if at all possible, so this limits me to a 2.0 silver top, although
I'm not averse to building up a black-top on a silvertop block or engine number... Needs a new flywheel and sump modifying for RWD. Easy to
turbo using a Focus RS manifold.
2) ST170 - Rarer to find in the price range of the alternatives, and certainly past any IVA Cat cut-off point. But the most powerful of the lot and
wouldn't take much boost to take it up to 250hp. Is there any possibility of building up a ST170 onto a silvertop pre-Cat block? Same as above
regarding flywheel and sump. Easy to turbo using a Focus RS manifold.
3) CA18DET - Complete with gearbox and turbo, these seem a nice package, but I understand that they are slightly heavy/tall? Advantages are that I can
get a pre-1995 engine, they are happy to have the boost turned up, and come ready in a RWD package. I appreciate that most of them will have eaten
their big ends, so will assume I need to replace these.
4) MX5 engine - choice of 1.8 or 1.6. The 1.8 I understand has a forged crank and will be a bit easier to boost to 250hp. Again, these come in a RWD
package, and I understand the gearbox on these is regarded higher than the mighty old MT75! I also have the ability to source a pre-1995 engine in
either guise (1.6 or 1.8) thus helping me avoid Cats. Will need to find a turbo manifold if I go this way.
Now all options I'm estimating can cost under £300 all-in, except if I go down the ST170 route.
I want the engine to be reliable, sound nice and feel nice. I'm not building this car for outright speed, and all the above can run similar sort
of power when boosted, so there's not much in it performance wise I guess - unless you tell me otherwise?
So.. Ford, Mazda or Nissan?
Or, do I just do what I am doing at the moment and keeping my options open and just monitoring ebay for the right pre-1995 engine to come along, and
buy whatever is cheapest/nearest to me?
Thanks
Pavel
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ashg
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| posted on 4/4/12 at 08:45 PM |
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go nissan, saab, or vauxhall. you will want an omega gearbox for the saab and vauxhall lumps. the saab will easily make 300bhp with the right turbo
and no internal mods.
Anything With Tits or Wheels Will cost you MONEY!!
Haynes Roadster (Finished)
Exocet (Finished & Sold)
New Project (Started)
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loggyboy
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| posted on 4/4/12 at 09:17 PM |
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Build it as a silvertop for IVA, then just add the blacktop and big mods retrospectively.
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Fizzer
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| posted on 4/4/12 at 10:14 PM |
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aren't there some cats floating around for long term loans for iva? Or am I making that up? anyone got a 'loaner'?
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PSpirine
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| posted on 4/4/12 at 10:35 PM |
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To be honest if going that way, I'd sooner "clarify" the "damaged" engine number of a "pre-1995 silvertop with
black cam covers"... 
I did look at Saab/Omega box combo, but struggle to find complete Saab engines with turbos for a decent price. I'm sort of over the whole
stripping a donor car down idea. In saabs it seems a complete car is cheaper than an engine..
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coozer
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| posted on 4/4/12 at 10:48 PM |
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I've just picked up a ST170 from a breakers for £200.. he has any other engines in for the same price including duratecs..
I'll now reveal my plan to turbo this engine and go for 350bhp.. just wish I'd saved me self the grand I spent on injection for it to only
reveal an extra 12bhp..
So far I've spent going for on £600 and have the motor, obx exhaust manifold and a Gt30 turbo from the states, I'm knocking up my own
inlet and the next step is an intercooler and pistons and rods, maybe another grand..
Seeing as I already have a st170 in it with an Omex 600 the basics are already there for it..
Looking forward to the brrrumm.. woooosh!
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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Volvorsport
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| posted on 4/4/12 at 11:13 PM |
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wot ho !!!!
youre not going to like it , but its swedish and rwd already......
www.dbsmotorsport.co.uk
getting dirty under a bus
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rost
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:35 AM |
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If you're considering a CA18DET, I'd also have a look at the SR20DET. It's the all-aluminum 2 liter successor of the CA18DET. The
S13 (redtop) versions are even kinda cheapish.
Charlie don't surf!
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PSpirine
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:45 AM |
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Wouldn't rule out a Volvo - what's the gearbox throw/ratios like, and how much does the whole thing weigh? Will it handle 250hp without
opening up the engine?
As for the SR20DET, I love those engines and am very familiar with them, but they're not actually much (if at all) lighter than the CA18DET due
to the gearbox. They also have all sorts of VVT and gearbox reliability problems which I just don't need as I'm not pushing for HP figures
which can't be achieved with the lesser engines..
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motorcycle_mayhem
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 08:26 AM |
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I've had no word from the chap that was after a Transit 2.5NA engine on here last week, so I still have two.
Both will readily mount up to MT75 gearboxes, in fact, both come with MT75 gearboxes, all ready to go.
They're both in fine fettle, absolutely beautiful runners. The Transits in which they sit, however, are dissolving.
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CNHSS1
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 09:31 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by PSpirine
Wouldn't rule out a Volvo - what's the gearbox throw/ratios like, and how much does the whole thing weigh? Will it handle 250hp without
opening up the engine?
As for the SR20DET, I love those engines and am very familiar with them, but they're not actually much (if at all) lighter than the CA18DET due
to the gearbox. They also have all sorts of VVT and gearbox reliability problems which I just don't need as I'm not pushing for HP figures
which can't be achieved with the lesser engines..
The SR and CA are about 5kg difference in reality and greaboxes are intechangeable if you swap bellhousings. The SRs a bit bulkier.
gearboxes are fine up to 300hp in a 1250kg nissan, and ive run 300hp with zero issues on hillclimb slicks (very hard on gearboxes) on an 800kg car.
Dont belive the web... ;-)
bot CA & SR are quite tall if you are looking at low bonnet heights tho
"Racing is life, everything else, before or after, is just waiting"---Steve McQueen
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PSpirine
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| posted on 7/4/12 at 08:42 AM |
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SR20's are way out of my budget unfortunately...
Got another wild-card choice - 1.8 M42 BMW engine out of a 318is. They can be had for under £100, and I've got a gearbox, wiring, ancillaries,
mounts and propshaft for one. I think they're about 130hp out of the box, so should be easily boosted since they've got a forged bottom
end.
Only problem I can see with the BMW lump is that it's canted over in the car... not sure what implications that has in the 7 (width issues?)
Pavel
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phelpsa
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| posted on 7/4/12 at 09:25 AM |
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Why fanny around with boat anchors when you could be putting a bike engine in?
Just thought I'd throw that in there...  
I wouldn't bother with the Mazda engines, they are a bit crude. The duratec is the only way to go really in terms of ease of installation, power
and potential. All the knowledge and bits are out there.
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phelpsa
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| posted on 7/4/12 at 09:26 AM |
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I don't understand why you think a 'forged bottom end' makes an engine any more suitable for forced induction?
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Volvorsport
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| posted on 9/4/12 at 05:08 PM |
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volvo engines are fine upto about 400 on the redblock , 300 - whiteblock , but it really does depend on which particular one you have ....
unfortunately , RWD volvos come with towbarge gear ratios , altho with a 3.3:1 backend arent too bad , there suited to an engine with torque(aka
turbo) because theyre widespaced if a little low in 1st and second .....
theres a myriad of concoctions you could fit to a whiteblock including type 9, type 5 , getrag , tremec etc . the std rwd gearboxes even in early
m46/m47 guise will live in a locost at 250 hp .
its a well trodden path to 250 bhp , since from the factory all the later cars have a towbarge cams and turbos.......
www.dbsmotorsport.co.uk
getting dirty under a bus
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Westy1994
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| posted on 9/4/12 at 05:55 PM |
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Hi all.
Not wishing to highjack the thread, but can I ask Volvorsport a question.
As a everyday car I have a 1995 940 Estate, its got the B230FB motor, as one of these days it's going to fail the MOT beyond economical
repair, will the engine fit into a 7 based chassis ( its a Westy) OK?, the engine is just great despite its 150K miles and uses no oil. The
G'Box fitted is the M47, but I already have a Type 9 already, so are sandwich plates available to match the two up?.
Cheers.
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Volvorsport
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| posted on 11/4/12 at 10:07 PM |
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b230fb would fit nicely.... no turbo hanging off the side , 130 hp too , dont think youd ned to change the box , but you say you have an M47 and not
an M90 ?
www.dbsmotorsport.co.uk
getting dirty under a bus
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Westy1994
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| posted on 12/4/12 at 01:38 AM |
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Hi,
No it's a M47 for sure, my car is most likely a 94 production run as I know from 95 onwards they went with the M90, which was stronger I
believe, the car most likely was stood around waiting to be sold just as they changed the gearbox run.
I will U2U you , as I have a few questions regarding the installation.
Cheers.
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