adithorp
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 10:44 AM |
|
|
Waterless coolant...
What do we think of WATERLESS
COOLANT ?
Apart from the cost, what are peoples opinions? I've seen some good reviews and the arguments seem sound. Seeing as I'm about to put a new
engine in and the system is dry, I'm tempted to go for it... Trouble is a little voice is wispering "snake oil" in my ear (that
voice has been wrong in the past though).
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
|
|
|
|
|
matt_gsxr
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 11:34 AM |
|
|
I've not used it.
What do you see as the benefit to you from using this?
Have you ever overheated. I'd worry about servicing in the field, you can normally find water.
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 11:47 AM |
|
|
Assuming the cooling system is in good order and provides adequate cooling I can't see the myself.
The no Oxygen thing doesn't hold IMHO as you will still have air present in the expansion tank (less Oxygen granted, but not zero).
For an all out race car where you might see benefits and possibly be able to reduce coolant volume (therefore weight) then it might be worth it.
Finally I'd agree with Matt's thinking as well on water availability for a road car situation.
|
|
|
ashg
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 11:52 AM |
|
|
sounds like a bad cure for an overheating engine.
Anything With Tits or Wheels Will cost you MONEY!!
Haynes Roadster (Finished)
Exocet (Finished & Sold)
New Project (Started)
|
|
|
TheGiantTribble
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 11:53 AM |
|
|
If you are worried about the chance of over heating you could always try
water wetter - - - > http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=74&pcid=10
Not try'd it myself yet (definitely thinking about when I finish the car)but
claims to reduce temp by up to 20 deg, so it certainly looks impressive and
you still use good old H2O.
|
|
|
40inches
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 12:07 PM |
|
|
Some info here.
Most impressive thing: No pressure in system at all, no matter how hot it gets 
Least impressive thing: The cost
[Edited on 13-3-14 by 40inches]
|
|
|
peter030371
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 12:26 PM |
|
|
I have been thinking the same thing as the OP but then I read its quite flammable......one tiny leak and you could be in trouble 
Once the cooling system is sorted I shouldn't have any leaks but its a new build, with lots of non-standard parts and I almost expect a few
issues when its first on the road. For that reason I will stick with water/ anti-freeze in the new build.
I have used water wetter in my current Striker, after 7-8 years I am still not sure it makes any difference
|
|
|
Brian R
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 12:57 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by peter030371
I have used water wetter in my current Striker, after 7-8 years I am still not sure it makes any difference
I concur with Peter above. We use it in our 750MC racecars and I'm not convinced it makes a great difference. Certainly not 20 degrees!
|
|
|
v8kid
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 01:11 PM |
|
|
Water wetter is just a surfactant with corrosion inhibitors added. there is an oxide/gas later between the water and the block which acts as an
insulating layer and the surfactant breaks this down.
I have used dishwasher tablets for the last 5 years in aluminium engines to great effect. In older engines the crud that comes out is amazing and in
my locost it lowered the water temp enough to make it usable ( using a polo rad with 400hp engine).
Cheers!
You'd be surprised how quickly the sales people at B&Q try and assist you after ignoring you for the past 15 minutes when you try and start a
chainsaw
|
|
|
Agriv8
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 02:18 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by v8kid
Water wetter is just a surfactant with corrosion inhibitors added. there is an oxide/gas later between the water and the block which acts as an
insulating layer and the surfactant breaks this down.
I have used dishwasher tablets for the last 5 years in aluminium engines to great effect. In older engines the crud that comes out is amazing and in
my locost it lowered the water temp enough to make it usable ( using a polo rad with 400hp engine).
Cheers!
I have heard this from a heavy plant mechanic doing this on blocks after oil contamination due to gasket failure or suspected silted up waterways.
ATB agriv8
Taller than your average Guy !
Management is like a tree of monkeys. - Those at the top look down and see a tree full of smiling faces. BUT Those at the bottom look up and see a
tree full of a*seholes .............
|
|
|
snapper
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 04:38 PM |
|
|
Dishwasher tabs in the car!
Probably safer than car parts in the dishwasher, domestically speaking
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
|
|
|
loggyboy
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 04:47 PM |
|
|
Surely the selling point that it boils hotter is acctually a bad point. - Surely its not the fact the water is boiling thats bad for an engine, its
getting too hot, so hotter water thats not boiling is just going to damage the engine further?
Mistral Motorsport
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 04:50 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
Dishwasher tabs in the car!
Probably safer than car parts in the dishwasher, domestically speaking
Do we deduce that you've been caught with your bits in the dishwasher then?
|
|
|
mark chandler
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 06:17 PM |
|
|
It's not as thermally efficient than water so if your cooling is marginal then best to avoid.
Personally I would not bother, decent OAT antifreeze with water is far cheaper and I'm tight
|
|
|
liam.mccaffrey
|
| posted on 13/3/14 at 06:57 PM |
|
|
I think the big plus is having zero pressure.
I work with pressure systems everyday and if I could get the same performance without the pressure i'd take it everytime.
Build Blog
Build Photo Album
|
|
|
v8kid
|
| posted on 14/3/14 at 08:34 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by nick205
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
Dishwasher tabs in the car!
Probably safer than car parts in the dishwasher, domestically speaking
Do we deduce that you've been caught with your bits in the dishwasher then?
At least they would be very clean bits 
You'd be surprised how quickly the sales people at B&Q try and assist you after ignoring you for the past 15 minutes when you try and start a
chainsaw
|
|
|
blakep82
|
| posted on 14/3/14 at 08:46 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by v8kid
quote:
Originally posted by nick205
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
Dishwasher tabs in the car!
Probably safer than car parts in the dishwasher, domestically speaking
Do we deduce that you've been caught with your bits in the dishwasher then?
At least they would be very clean bits
I hope he doesn't work in a restaurant, and the dish washer isnt a female member of staff 
Seen this no water thing used on a triumph or something on wheeler dealers. They said it was great, then never used it again. Probably paid by the
manufacturer
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
|
|
|
scimjim
|
| posted on 14/3/14 at 04:27 PM |
|
|
I believe that it's banned in some racetracks in the US as it's flammable and very "slippery"?
Having said that, I have a friend that's an Evans distributor and he obviously has it in his car. In addition to not boiling, not corroding
(relatively speaking) and zero pressure, the main bonus is that it never needs changing - so those that say it's expensive are only looking at
initial costs, not whole life cost.
oh - and you can add water in an emergency - but you'll need a full (expensive) drain and clean if you want to go back to waterless.
|
|
|
britishtrident
|
| posted on 14/3/14 at 04:36 PM |
|
|
The use of ethylene glycol based coolants was one of the big advances in engine technology, glycol with OAT corrosion protection takes a lot of
beating.
If conventional OAT coolant isn't doing the job something is far wrong.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
|
|
|
britishtrident
|
| posted on 14/3/14 at 04:40 PM |
|
|
Be aware dishwasher detergents can be very different chemically some contain Citric Acid while others contain Sodium hydroxide and Sodium
Hypochlorite both of which are strong alkalis which eat aluminum and magnesium and rusts ferrous metals.
[Edited on 14/3/14 by britishtrident]
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
|
|
|
coyoteboy
|
| posted on 14/3/14 at 06:10 PM |
|
|
What people don't seem to see is that nucleate boiling phase heat transfer is significantly better (like 10-30%) than standard forced
convection, removing boiling points could actually reduce the cooling efficiency.
Cooler coolant temps suggests it's highly possible it's not pulling heat out of the block/head fast enough or it has higher specific heat
capacity, as the heat transfer coefficient to the rads/blocks won't vary much between fluids. If it has vastly higher specific heat capacity
than water then fair enough, but they don't claim that and there's very few liquids (at room temp) that have a higher specific heat
capacity than plain old water, so I'd want to see
1)More data that proves it's not just less efficient at removing heat but doesn't boil either.
2)Head/block temp comparisons under lab conditions
3)An explanation as to why pressurised systems are such an issue, there's been countless millions of them trucking around and assuming
there's no fault with them there's no problem with them being pressurised.
[Edited on 14/3/14 by coyoteboy]
|
|
|
scimjim
|
| posted on 14/3/14 at 08:08 PM |
|
|
I think you're confusing water-wetter (which claims to reduce coolant temps) with waterless coolant. Evans doesn't run cooler - they
specifically point out in the blurb that it may run up to 10 deg hotter due to poorer heat transfer?
|
|
|
coyoteboy
|
| posted on 24/3/14 at 08:23 PM |
|
|
I don't know who you were aiming that at but I was answering an earlier message about water wetter in line with the Evans answer. I can't
find anything about Evans running hotter, care to link? But are they talking the engine running hotter or the coolant?
|
|
|
scimjim
|
| posted on 24/3/14 at 09:16 PM |
|
|
http://www.evanscoolants.co.uk/technical/questions-&-answers/38
|
|
|
