Marty
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| posted on 23/11/04 at 04:00 AM |
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Golf 1 donor car
Does anyone know of a mid/rear engined car built from a front wheel drive vehicle (apart from a Mini - I have read the mail).
I have a mechanically sound Golf 1 in my garden that has a badly rusted body due to the high humidity and salt air here in Richards Bay, South Africa.
and it seems a shame not to make use of it.
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Rorty
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| posted on 23/11/04 at 04:22 AM |
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Marty, welcome to the online residential facility for the automotively depraved. 
If you look down through some of the Mid Engine posts, you'll come across such characters as AlanB, sgrabber, kb58 and others (sorry guys, I
can't remember all the names without browsing...doesn't mean you're any less important!).
They have used transverse front wheel drive engines in the "right" location.
From a driveline aspect, the Golf would be a good donorand the engines can be quite respectable too.
Cheers, Rorty.
"Faster than a speeding Pullet".
PLEASE DON'T U2U ME IF YOU WANT A QUICK RESPONSE. TRY EMAILING ME INSTEAD!
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sgraber
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| posted on 23/11/04 at 04:51 AM |
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Marty, If you think you can build a mid-engine sports car out of an old Golf, you are crazy.
Welcome to the club! The Bolwell Ikara was an early 80's middy built using the Golf as a donor. Dominic, who is building a middy in Australia
has the following page with more information. http://members.optushome.com.au/gecko/ikara.html It was a great little car that was just a bit ugly
(IMHO).
So I guess the key thought here is that you should start stripping that donor ASAP. 
Graber
PS - click on my www button below to visit my site.
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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ned
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| posted on 23/11/04 at 09:41 AM |
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take a look at the sylva mojo, fwd drivetrain at the back.. www.sylva.co.uk i think..
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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Alan B
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| posted on 23/11/04 at 12:43 PM |
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Marty,
You are one sick and twisted individual.
WELCOME
<manly group hug>
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derf
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| posted on 23/11/04 at 02:22 PM |
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If I were to build a middy there are a few engine choices I would go with, my main choice is a honda b16 or b18, mainly due to the aftermarket
support. Right behind that is Ford's Zetec (I've dyno'd mine at 266 Hp at the wheels with 12 psi on a stock engine, good fuel
management is the key to a long engine life. Along side Ford's Zetec is Toyota's ZZTTII (?) (from the new model Celica, also used in
various other Toyota 4 Cyl's), I just love the new technology they put in it.
Anyway The Golf engine is a good compromise between all of them. The stock internals are fairly stout, and will hold their own in a heavy use
environment, the aftermarket support is abundant (not sure about SA, but here in the US it is), it has been proven as a winner time and time again in
SCCA competition, and at the time it was a fairly advanced (technologically) engine. Overall it's a good engine right down the middle.
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TheGecko
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| posted on 24/11/04 at 07:28 AM |
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Marty,
Welcome to the insanity Thanks Steve, for pointing Marty to my Ikara page. It reminded me that I need to shift that page from my old Optus web
space to my new host. At the same time I should restore all of the scanned magazine pages that used to be linked from that page before I ran out of
space.
As Ned points out, the Sylva Mojo is a perfect example of what you're proposing. Neither the engineering or styling of the Mojo really do it
for me but, each to their own.
Other examples include the GTM Libra & Spyder (here) and the Car Craft Cyclone (sadly gone now).
Best of luck,
Dominic
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violentblue
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| posted on 25/11/04 at 07:58 PM |
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I'm actually considering throwing my G60turbo in the back of my golf. just so I have better traction at the track.
and if i get really stupid I could add a matching engine in the front.
a few pics of my other projects
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DarrenW
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| posted on 26/11/04 at 10:31 AM |
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Dubsport did a couple of twin engined Golfs a while back. Got some fantastic write ups in mags.
link - http://www.dubsport.com
The problem with Golf engine feeding rear wheels is finding or mating suitable gearbox to it. Not impossible just needs sussing out. 1.8 16V was
always a good competitor to VX XE. VR6 is known to be a bit heavy though, was always a bit of a problem in a Mk1, dubsport had a novel way of
overcoming this. If you manage to get some internal pics you will see the gear linkage - could be interesting.
A guy round the corner from me is building Mojo2 with Honda 2.0 Vtec (and moddified with throttle bodies!!!). Gear linkage was a nightmare but the
managed it inhome garage. Had to the link under the engine right to back of car and then into gearbox. Shafts work through bearing blocks.
HTH
Darren.
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Rorty
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| posted on 26/11/04 at 01:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
Had to the link under the engine right to back of car and then into gearbox. Shafts work through bearing blocks.
Shafts normally only work properly if there is a line-of-sight between the connections. Bends, bearings etc will leave it very spongey.
A line-of-sight rod works best, otherwise cables with quality fittings work extremely well. In my experience that is.
Cheers, Rorty.
"Faster than a speeding Pullet".
PLEASE DON'T U2U ME IF YOU WANT A QUICK RESPONSE. TRY EMAILING ME INSTEAD!
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sgraber
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| posted on 26/11/04 at 03:35 PM |
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Shifter mechanism.
You need to take a good read of Kurt Bilinskis Mid-Engine Mini page. http://www.kimini.com/Diaries/Pre2003/index.html
Follow that link and look about 2/3 way down the page. October 2002 through November 2002 dedicated to solving the shifter issue. But he did a great
job and one worth copying I think. (Hope that's ok Kurt!)
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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violentblue
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| posted on 26/11/04 at 05:21 PM |
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I'll be using the stock g60 cableshift box.
but if you wanted to go longitudaly mounted you could use a Fox tranny or another Audi variant.(fox box will do, but you'll need to baby it)
the 5000T box would be perfect, except it has a larger bellhousing pattern (same pattern but larger)
a few pics of my other projects
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Rorty
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| posted on 26/11/04 at 08:51 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by sgraber
Shifter mechanism.
You need to take a good read of Kurt Bilinskis Mid-Engine Mini page. http://www.kimini.com/Diaries/Pre2003/index.html
Follow that link and look about 2/3 way down the page. October 2002 through November 2002 dedicated to solving the shifter issue. But he did a great
job and one worth copying I think. (Hope that's ok Kurt!)
Kurt mentions "about 1/8" of backlash" (however much that is  ), but is satisfied with the final result.
If you're going this route, buy only the good quality cables, as sloppy ones will reveal small amounts of backlash which is no better than a
convoluted rod gear change.
The top quality cable manufacturers use very high tech materials and processes to eliminate backlash, and it's worth paying the extra for the
benefits.
Kurt, if you read this, what brand of cables did you use? You mentioned Cable Craft at the start of the sequence, but I suspect that was like calling
spherical rod ends "Heim joints" or "Rose joints".
BTW, why does nobody call them "Aurora joints"? I think Aurora are the world's leading spherical joint manufacturer.
Cheers, Rorty.
"Faster than a speeding Pullet".
PLEASE DON'T U2U ME IF YOU WANT A QUICK RESPONSE. TRY EMAILING ME INSTEAD!
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Marty
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| posted on 27/11/04 at 05:21 AM |
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Golf 1 donor car
I must thank everyone who replied to my suggestions that I might be able to turn my rusting Golf 1 into an interesting mid engined car.
Everyone's humour greatly appeals to me!
I am nervous about such a project as I know how much work is involved. Although I have been retired for a couple of years I still don't know
where the time goes and how I ever found time to go to work for almost fifty years I don't know.
The web site is so large that it takes hours on line to read even parts of it.Where should I look to find a basic space frame design?
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MrFluffy
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| posted on 27/11/04 at 11:22 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Rorty
BTW, why does nobody call them "Aurora joints"? I think Aurora are the world's leading spherical joint manufacturer.
Because according to mr stanniforths chassis book, the Rose company was the main importer/distributer of spherical joints in england and it became a
generic term a bit like a hoover for a vacumn cleaner
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Rorty
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| posted on 27/11/04 at 11:37 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MrFluffy
... the Rose company was the main importer/distributer of spherical joints in england and it became a generic term ...
Yes, I grew up with "Rose joints". In my innocence, for years I asumed they were called rose joints because they resembled roses. 
And Philip's head screws...
Cheers, Rorty.
"Faster than a speeding Pullet".
PLEASE DON'T U2U ME IF YOU WANT A QUICK RESPONSE. TRY EMAILING ME INSTEAD!
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Peteff
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| posted on 27/11/04 at 01:25 PM |
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There's a reason for that one.
He usually keeps it covered though.
 
Rescued attachment phil the greek.jpg
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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kb58
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| posted on 27/11/04 at 05:23 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Rorty
...
Kurt, if you read this, what brand of cables did you use? You mentioned Cable Craft at the start of the sequence, but I suspect that was like calling
spherical rod ends "Heim joints" or "Rose joints".
"Cablecraft" is the name of the company, they're in Los Angeles, California. I was very happy with their product and service other
then the issue I pointed out. If the cable is not curved in application, there is no backlash, none. The problem arises when the cable is bent, say,
90 degrees. There is an inner and outer subassembly that aren' really connected. That is, the inner actual cable and cover rides inside the
outer covering. So there is a bit of clearence between the two. With the assembly bent, it allows the inside sub-assembly to move sideways, that is
the source of the backlash. If it bugs me enough someday I can maybe inject something through the outer cover to lock the inner sheath in place, but
it hasn't been a problem in "all" my testing (two laps around the block...)
[Edited on 11/27/04 by kb58]
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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Rorty
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| posted on 27/11/04 at 09:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by kb58
"Cablecraft" is the name of the company, they're in Los Angeles, California.
.... the inner actual cable and cover rides inside the outer covering. So there is a bit of clearence between the two. With the assembly bent, it
allows the inside sub-assembly to move sideways, that is the source of the backlash.
I'm glad you pointed that out. I've been recommending Cablecraft as one of the sources of cables to mu US customers for years, based
purely on their notoriety.
I've never had any complaints from my customers about sloppy gear changes, so eitheer they didn't end up purchasing their cables from
Cablecraft, or the backlash is too insignificant to matter.
In Australia, I use two different products: one is locally made, and the other is imported from the US. The US version is very expensive and IIRC,
comes from Uflex.
They really are the answer to remote control; everything from gear linkages to throttle cables to steering linkages.
Cheers, Rorty.
"Faster than a speeding Pullet".
PLEASE DON'T U2U ME IF YOU WANT A QUICK RESPONSE. TRY EMAILING ME INSTEAD!
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fatfranky
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| posted on 4/12/04 at 01:18 PM |
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HI Marty
If you fancy going the VW route then it could be worth considering a newer Golf. Mk2 Golfs used an engine mounting subframe which of course could
simply be bolted to your chassis, Mk3 Golfs used a very similar arrangement and some models used a cable change gearbox, making the gear linkage a bit
easier. Mk3's are also about 3" wider (wider track) if that suits you, as an alternative you could also consider the Passat with the
transverse engine as it was basically a "big Golf" in mechanical terms
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sgraber
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| posted on 4/12/04 at 07:53 PM |
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I think our friend already has an MKI golf that he wants to use as a donor.
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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kango
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| posted on 9/12/04 at 06:34 PM |
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In SA we have a huge following for the Golf and performance parts are plentyfull.
I have the same idea for my next car ...so has anybody done it?
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