whitestu
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 08:50 AM |
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quote:
In reality there has to be a massive shift in behaviour, and the human race is not well known for being benevolent, we are in general driven to
survive, consume, and procreate.
I agree - I wonder if the period of modern history where we have had cheap energy through coal, gas and oil is just a blip in human history and after
a few wars we'll settle back down to farming like we did for tens of thousand of years before.
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GeorgeM
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 09:37 AM |
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Noooooooo.,
can you imagine the protests, strikes, wars......
people having to do things for themselves !!
most of us on here would survive quite well if we had to MAKE or REPAIR things
but how would all those people who can only use a microwave for coooking,
can't fit a plug, don't know how to grow anything etc etc manage ????
sounds like mad max 
add the rising water...Waterworld
My conscience is clear - I drive a GREEN car
MNR Racing
essexkitcarclub.com
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ali f27
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 11:02 AM |
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Real problem is government plc lab con lib all the same country is very badly run waste everywhere gov would not last 5 mins in comercial world why
cant we employ some comercial managers to do proper job then tax would be less or a least well spent
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craig1410
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 11:12 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ali f27
Real problem is government plc lab con lib all the same country is very badly run waste everywhere gov would not last 5 mins in comercial world why
cant we employ some comercial managers to do proper job then tax would be less or a least well spent
Smaller government = less waste which is why I always vote conservative.
I agree there is still too much waste but hopefully the constrained budgets we are introducing will make those who spend the money think more
carefully how it should be spent. After 10+ years of labour government there should be plenty of fat to trim away in my opinion. The government should
take a leaf out of Apple's books and run the country like a startup business. Keep teams small and make sure empowerment, responsibility and
accountability are high on the agenda.
Here is a quote from the recent "Inside Apple" article in Fortune magazine:
quote:
Steve Jobs gives employees a little speech when they're promoted to Vice President at Apple, according to Adam Lashinsky in a new article
in Fortune that's not online yet. Lashinsky calls it the "Difference Between the Janitor and the Vice President."
Jobs tells the VP that if the garbage in his office is not being emptied regularly for some reason, he would ask the janitor what the problem is. The
janitor could reasonably respond by saying, "Well, the lock on the door was changed, and I couldn't get a key." An irritation for
Jobs, for an understandable excuse for why the janitor couldn't do his job.
As a janitor, he's allowed to have excuses. "When you're the janitor, reasons matter," Jobs tells newly minted VPs, according
to Lashinsky. "Somewhere between the janitor and the CEO, reasons stop mattering," says Jobs, adding, that Rubicon is "crossed when
you become a VP." In other words, you have no excuse for failure. You are now responsible for any mistakes that happen, and it doesn't
matter what you say.
A bit more of this in government would go a long way!!
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A1
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 11:56 AM |
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behind them 100%
the government are robbing us blind and using the excuse of paying back national debt to do it, when really theyre spending it so that people can live
off the state. ( i know not everyone does, but i know more people that are scamming it than not)
if fuel prices were lower, more businesses would be able to produce stuff that we could sell abroad in order to bring some money IN to the country.
which is what we need to do to pay off the national debt otherwise were just sloshing water in a bucket.
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mrwibble
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 12:12 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by A1
behind them 100%
the government are robbing us blind and using the excuse of paying back national debt to do it, when really theyre spending it so that people can live
off the state. ( i know not everyone does, but i know more people that are scamming it than not)
if fuel prices were lower, more businesses would be able to produce stuff that we could sell abroad in order to bring some money IN to the country.
which is what we need to do to pay off the national debt otherwise were just sloshing water in a bucket.
hmm but i think its not the current governments fault for the benefit culture that has taken root in this country... and its the current government
which are trying to tackle benefit claim abuse and get them into work...
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Ninehigh
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 05:36 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mrwibble
quote:
Originally posted by A1
behind them 100%
the government are robbing us blind and using the excuse of paying back national debt to do it, when really theyre spending it so that people can live
off the state. ( i know not everyone does, but i know more people that are scamming it than not)
if fuel prices were lower, more businesses would be able to produce stuff that we could sell abroad in order to bring some money IN to the country.
which is what we need to do to pay off the national debt otherwise were just sloshing water in a bucket.
hmm but i think its not the current governments fault for the benefit culture that has taken root in this country... and its the current government
which are trying to tackle benefit claim abuse and get them into work...
But if there were jobs for these people to go into because more businesse would be able to produce stuff because fuel prices were lower then they
wouldn't need high fuel prices to pay for the sick, lame and lazy (and unlucky!) who live off the government
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craig1410
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 05:50 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Ninehigh
quote:
Originally posted by mrwibble
quote:
Originally posted by A1
behind them 100%
the government are robbing us blind and using the excuse of paying back national debt to do it, when really theyre spending it so that people can live
off the state. ( i know not everyone does, but i know more people that are scamming it than not)
if fuel prices were lower, more businesses would be able to produce stuff that we could sell abroad in order to bring some money IN to the country.
which is what we need to do to pay off the national debt otherwise were just sloshing water in a bucket.
hmm but i think its not the current governments fault for the benefit culture that has taken root in this country... and its the current government
which are trying to tackle benefit claim abuse and get them into work...
But if there were jobs for these people to go into because more businesse would be able to produce stuff because fuel prices were lower then they
wouldn't need high fuel prices to pay for the sick, lame and lazy (and unlucky!) who live off the government
I don't think you can say that fuel duty pays for benefits, not in any direct sense. The fuel duty setup was established a while ago, it is just
an unfortunate combination of oil prices, VAT increase and the natural increase of fuel prices through inflation that makes it look expensive. That
and the fact many (most) of us have not had pay rises in recent years even through inflation is around 4%. If fuel was £1.15 then that would probably
be about right but we have recently crossed a psychological barrier in to £1.30+ (petrol) and £1.40+(diesel) and even higher in outlying areas so it
seems disproportionately high.
Due to our Labour "credit card" balance, what the government can't afford to do is change the way duty is calculated and then when
(if) oil prices go back to a more "normal" level the government has a shortfall on tax income. Any change to the duty will cost money and
take time to implement, you can't just announce it on the spur of the moment.
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JoelP
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 05:59 PM |
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i take the approach that if someone is to be paid by the government, they may as well be paid to do something. Id start with picking up rubbish as it
needs no skills and makes a pleasant difference to messy areas.
Benefit system does need massive overhaul but you cannot realistically yank the rug from under people, as there arent actually jobs for them anyway.
Needs to be a progressive but constant and determined change.
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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GeorgeM
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 06:58 PM |
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how about starting by getting low cost housing built.
Like the old council houses. All the people on benefit
in expensive private lets could be given one. Builders
would have jobs, gov't would save on housing benefit.
Be a bit like after the 2nd world war (so I'm told )
My conscience is clear - I drive a GREEN car
MNR Racing
essexkitcarclub.com
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JoelP
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 07:42 PM |
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good call george, social housing sets me off on a rant on a good day.
People pay council tax to subsidise the building and maintainance of houses, which are rented out cheap, then sold cheap to the lucky few who can blag
it, whilst most people try to do it themselves, and end up paying loads more for their own house, whilst still subsidising the, lets be honest,
scroungers who didnt fancy paying full market rent themselves. And now theres barely any council houses left, we have to all turn our pockets out to
build more to give away again.
What a polava.
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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norfolkluego
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 07:58 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
hydrogen atoms might be common as muck but hydrogen molecules arent. If you are making hydrogen molecules by hydrolysis of water, then it isnt an
energy source, its just a method of storing and moving energy. Icelands geothermal or hydroelectric suppies arent going to underwriite the whole
venture!
True, but it is the future fuel for cars unless someone invents a battery far in advance of anything that we have now and those batteries would still
have to get their electricity from the same sources as the Hydrogen. Fuel cell technology was good enough to put men on the Moon over 40 years ago,
it'll get me to work and back. The technology is well proven.
[Edited on 10/5/11 by norfolkluego]
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JoelP
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 09:02 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by norfolkluego
quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
hydrogen atoms might be common as muck but hydrogen molecules arent. If you are making hydrogen molecules by hydrolysis of water, then it isnt an
energy source, its just a method of storing and moving energy. Icelands geothermal or hydroelectric suppies arent going to underwriite the whole
venture!
True, but it is the future fuel for cars unless someone invents a battery far in advance of anything that we have now and those batteries would still
have to get their electricity from the same sources as the Hydrogen. Fuel cell technology was good enough to put men on the Moon over 40 years ago,
it'll get me to work and back. The technology is well proven.
[Edited on 10/5/11 by norfolkluego]
100% agree, i was just pointing out that fuel cells still need energy to fill them, so dont address our most pressing problem.
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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Ninehigh
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| posted on 10/5/11 at 09:17 PM |
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The Honda FXC was advertised as having a home filling station, there weren't many details given but it looked like electolysis powered by solar
and wind. They still need mass pestering to stop screwing around with only having them in Calafornia and start raking in the money worldwide by
actually doing something with them
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morcus
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| posted on 11/5/11 at 02:56 AM |
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I'd like to make it clear that I understand that A, the method of Hydrogen power I suggested is essentially a battery system and B that I
don't realistically think Iceland could power the world.
Hydrogen fuel cells seem to be a better method of energy transfer as with the right infostructure it as easy to fill up as petrol. It also appears to
be what some major car makers are working on at the moment and like I said it's as clean as Electric power. How we generate than power is
another issue.
To go back to the original topic though, none of this governments policy was secret, it was all out in the open. If you don't like it
you've left it abit late and should have done something before the last election (And before we have any coalition nonsense, the Conservatives
won more seats than anyone else, and a LabDem Coalition would have been a minority Government even if you don't count the Sinn Fein Seats as
they don't take the oath so don't vote in the house.)
In a White Room, With Black Curtains, By the Station.
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Richard Quinn
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| posted on 11/5/11 at 04:47 AM |
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I've just been looking at a new company car. As far as I can see, the one I was looking at (together with a fuel card) is going to be costing me
around £6k a year in tax whether I put fuel in or not. There are no hybrids etc apart from the Lexus's (Lexii?) out there in the class of car
I'm looking at.
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franky
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| posted on 11/5/11 at 06:33 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Richard Quinn
I've just been looking at a new company car. As far as I can see, the one I was looking at (together with a fuel card) is going to be costing me
around £6k a year in tax whether I put fuel in or not. There are no hybrids etc apart from the Lexus's (Lexii?) out there in the class of car
I'm looking at.
how much are you being paid or what car are you looking at that'll cost you 6k a year!?
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Richard Quinn
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| posted on 12/5/11 at 06:09 AM |
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I did say that it was for the car and fuel card. The car itself will cost about £3.8k and the fuel card costs £2k. It's a £36k car with a 26%
charge based on CO2 and I'll be paying tax on it at 40%
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