thefreak
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 03:55 PM |
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Do I need planning permission to move a fence?
Interested to hear views on this.
We own a property and want to move the fence line out to the edge of the roadwa to utilise the rest of the garden.
This is the current fenceline (in yellow):
We would like to move it out to the edge of the block paved shared driveway, like below:
New fenceline in green and a strip of slabs between block pave and fence in orange.
Checked the deeds (new build <3 years old) and it says we're not allowed unless we get the say so from the developers.
Spoke to them and they have no problem, and have a letter confirming now.
They've said it doen't constitute either planning or building regs approval though.
Speaking to the local council, to speak to planning means paying! But the interactive portal here:
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/permission/house
Suggests the following:
You need to apply for planning permission if you wish to erect or add a to a fence, wall or gate and it's over 1m hight and next to a highway
used by vehicles (it will be 2m)
Now the highway is at the end of the driveway. The block paved area on the picture is a shared driveway, shared by the 9 houses.
The gap between the fence and the driveway would be aprox 1 400mm slab width.
So.. if you're still with me here  do I need to apply for planning for this minor change?
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thefreak
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 03:56 PM |
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Just read a bit further on the portal page here:
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/permission/commonprojects/fenceswallsgates
Which says:
You will not need to apply for planning permission to take down a fence, wall,or gate, or to alter, maintain or improve an existing fence, wall or
gate (no matter how high) if you don't increase its height. In a conservation area, however, you might need conservation area consent to take
down a fence, wall or gate.
We are altering and existing fence and not increasing it's height... does that mean we're ok?
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andyace
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 04:08 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by thefreak
We are altering and existing fence and not increasing it's height... does that mean we're ok?
I would think that that refers to altering an existing fence in the same location ... you are moving it which is different.
I guess the issue is whether or not they class a 'drive'way as a 'high'way
Can you not phone planning to ask them if that clause relates to an off road driveway?
[Edited on 9/5/13 by andyace]
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jamiepearson69
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 04:08 PM |
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You wont need PP for that.
The only thing I would be careful of is to make sure that there is no restrictive covenant on the title deeds which restrict you moving the the fence.
Even with a letter from the developers, you would technically need to have a deed of variation to be squeeky clean.
Having said that, the chances of anyone bothering to enforce it would be slim to non and also costly to the enforcer!
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tul214
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 04:43 PM |
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I would agree with the above. You shouldn't need planning but be aware that there may be utilities in that verge and if they need access they
will rip the fence down.
1.6 Raw Super6 sold
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peter030371
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 05:18 PM |
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I had exactly the same thing...only the developers of my house went bust in 1967 so I couldn't ask for permission! The council here would not
give an opinion without a full set of drawings and also crossing there palms with silver 
In the end we just did it (but talked to our next door neighbors first so they new what was going on) and nearly 2 years later know one has complained
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mark chandler
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 05:38 PM |
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No need for pp for a wooden fence, it's a private driveway so banging up a wooden fence 2m high is fine as you have permission from the
builders.
I would socialise what you are doing with the neighbours but at the end of the day it's your property.
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britishtrident
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 05:40 PM |
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Looks like a great way to fallout with your neighbours, our street has a not dissimilar layout and I can assure you if the neighbour at the end of
the street tried anything like that it was cause major trouble ,
I would also check if you actually have title to the land, I would be very surprised if you do.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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thefreak
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 05:41 PM |
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You've not seen the posts about our delightful next door neighbour have you?
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thefreak
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 05:42 PM |
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Also, we've checked with the developers, it's ours to the block paved area, seen it on the as well.
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Acc8braman
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| posted on 9/5/13 at 06:26 PM |
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Hi,
Speaking from experience, you need to consult with planning as the land does not belong to you.
The planners will look at the land and apply to change the useage to garden or something like that.
This is only the case if the land has been adopted by them.
If its still owned by the developer, you deal with them only.
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zetec-phill
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 06:28 AM |
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check with the local highways, ask them if the block paved drive as been adopted by them?
if it hasnt then you should be ok, as its nothing to do with them
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nick205
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 02:14 PM |
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Brother in law did this with developers consent and no planning required. That was the easy bit! He got untold grief of the neighbours, who thought
he was land grabbing on the sly. He had taken the time to speak to his immediate neighbours beforehand, but once the fence was up they decide to take
offence. The fence is still there mind.
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PAUL FISHER
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 02:28 PM |
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The main problem I can see with errecting a 2m high fence along the orange line is is "visibility splay" from the driveway of the house
next door, onto the block paved road, that why I think that area has been left open, although it belongs to you.
[Edited on 19/05/04 by PAUL FISHER]
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thefreak
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 02:40 PM |
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Well the driveway isn't the council's as it says we are liable for 50% of the upkeep and plot 5 the other 50%.
Plus both plot 5 and 3 are currently going through divorces and will be moving out this year (fingers crossed for plot 5 as he's a prize tool!)
I've managed to get hold of someone at the local planning department and they've umm'd and arrr'd about it and decided
it's best I pay the £35 to submit a pre-application form and they'll review it properly.
As you can see, the fence would come out further and block a little more of plot 3's few around the corner, but it's a parking space in
front of a garage, not a T junction onto a busy road She drives in forward anyway so can't see when she's reversing out until
she's already on the main paved area.
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PAUL FISHER
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 02:53 PM |
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I was thinking more of plot 26's visabilty splay, but think your wise to spend £35 just to make sure
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thefreak
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 02:56 PM |
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Plot 26? that's their garden backing onto our double garage.
Our house is the red one, our garage is the red one as well.
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PAUL FISHER
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 03:04 PM |
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So the pink garage belongs to plot 3? if so its his visabilty splay on to the blocked paved road?, its difficult to see from the plan, a detailed map
could be better
[Edited on 19/05/04 by PAUL FISHER]
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thefreak
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 03:25 PM |
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The single pink garage next to the double red belongs to plot 3 yes.
Does visabilty splay come into play though with it being into a private courtyard (council's words)
[Edited on 10-5-13 by thefreak]
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PAUL FISHER
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 03:32 PM |
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And your double garage in red is to the side of that?, but your fence in orange will still effect plot 3's visabilty splay onto the blocked
paved road? if it is 2 metres high?
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Julian T
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 03:43 PM |
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You may be advised to start small, perhaps with bushes (that will grow) into a hedge, then fence it in. That way the impact is almost unseen. I did
this several years ago in almost exactly the same situation and no one said a word.
I'd do the rest of that bit of grass in front of the house at the same time.
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PAUL FISHER
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 03:53 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by thefreak
The single pink garage next to the double red belongs to plot 3 yes.
Does visabilty splay come into play though with it being into a private courtyard (council's words)
[Edited on 10-5-13 by thefreak]
I think thats why you need to spend the £35, I went through all this with my house 12 years ago, did almost the same thing as you on my land!!!!, onto
a block paved area, the council told me to to take the fence down, as it was blocking a visabilty splay to next door, but that was 12 years ago but my
fence is still up  , they did not enforce it after the guy next door moved out
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thefreak
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 04:24 PM |
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Plot 3 are moving out in the next couple of months anyway, as she and husband are getting divorced, so I'm hoping if its in before they move out
(she doesn't mind at all) it'll all be good
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Peteff
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 07:44 PM |
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Does the land belong to you as it is outside your boundary or is it a ransom strip ? If it is a ransom strip it will be up to the original owner or
the developer who you say has no problem with it. Is there going to be access into the rear of your property via a gate in the fence ?
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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thefreak
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| posted on 10/5/13 at 08:32 PM |
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Just checked the land registry deeds and the red outline is what we own.
The red area and the mirrored other side upto 1/2 way down the drive are labelled as a private drive area.
Do the council have say on visibility splay on private land? And how is it measured? As if the car is parked facing away from the garage, at what
point shoulld the angle be measured? We're going to lay a 40x40cm slabbed path along the length of the edge where it meets the block paving
area, which should give the visibility so she doesn't go hurtling off her driveway not being able to see someone coming down the drive at 5mph
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